Re: Malakal Made A Huge Mistake Voting Joel Out


"Ed Stasiak" <estasiak@xxxxxxx> wrote:

No, it was clear that Eliza's tribe had almost finished their puzzle
(despite being way behind to begin with) before Mongo started
barking,

You do not know when he 'started barking'. Ozzy was there and even he
stated that Joel was tlaking the whole time and caused the loss. I'll take
Ozzy's word over your opinion on what the heavily edited version of the
challenge showed, especially since Ozzy supports my opinion. ;-).

We have heard Joel barking orders in the background at most of the
challenges. In my opinion, Joel is not calpable of standing there in
total silence until it was 'almost over'. In my opinion, it is far more
likely that he was offering helpful advise (like 'go faster') throughout
the puzzle
solving phase.

So because Mongo has barked in the past, he must have been
barking the whole time Chet was valiantly trying to lead his tribe
to victory, even thou we didn't see Mongo barking until it was
almost over?

We didn't see most of the challenge. Why is it that you feel you can claim
that Joel was quiet during all the parts we didn't see? Your claim does not
make sense in the context of everything we have been shown of Joel at
challenges.

Regardless, Eliza's tribe was stacked with the better puzzle solving
players.

LOL! Yes, Mr.Furley is blameless! If only stupid Mongo had
busted a bunch of tiles and given his tribe _an even bigger lead_
they would have stomped Eliza and the Jedi Puzzle Solvers!

I did not say that Chet was 'blameless'. The simple fact is that Chet did
not cause the loss. Chet, in fact, was a better contributor in the
challenge than Joel since Joel did nothing in his part of the challenge and
then provided a direct hinderance when his tribemates were trying to solve
the puzzle.

So, what kind of job is it that Joel had that allowed the plate breaking
portion of the challenge to be completed without any contribution at all
from Joel? he did exactly NOTHING of benefit in the challenge.

IIRC, there were 3 tile bundles and 4 throwers for each tribe and
as I do remember Mongo throwing and missing at least twice, that
means the other 3 players on his tribe also missed a few throws.

What we saw was absolute proof that Joel did NOT hit anything. Therefore,
Joel did exactly nothing of benefit for his tribe in the challenge.

Mongo's tribe had a huge lead _despite_ him not breaking a tile (and
did all of the other players hit their tile on the first throw?)

Why mention 'first throw'? Joel didn't hit a tile with any throw.

See above.

The above is proof that Joel did not hit anything on any throw, so why limit
your discussion to accuracy on the first throw? For all we know, they each
took 10 throws. There is no way to know how many missed throws were edited
out, but we did see every HIT and we know that Joel was not a player that
hit anything.

Meanwhile, his tribe only had a lead because James was very unlucky in
the way he hit 2 of the tiles; causing them to break, but not fall.

I also remember Jonathon and Bon Jovi hitting but not shattering tiles

So? How does that change the fact that James' throws hit the tiles and
managed to make the target half as big as it was before? That is BAD LUCK
on James part, not any lack of throwing skill.

But it was Mongo's fault for not giving his tribe a bigger lead....

Joel did not give his tribe any lead. Joel did not hit any target. Joel
contributed absolutely nothing to the lead. The only contribution Joel made
to the challenge was in hindering his tribe and preventing them from
completing the puzzle as we saw in the editting and as was confirmed by Ozzy
in his confessional clip shows on CBS's web page.

But you're right, it wasn't even close. Chet had pieces all over the
place and didn't even have the center zig-zag complete before Eliza
and her Jedi Puzzle Solvers had won.

Why do you give Eliza's three puzzle workers credit, but place all the blame
on Chet alone? Your argument simply does not hold water. 4 players from
each tribe worked on the puzzle and none of them can be given 100% of the
blame (or credit) for how well the tribe did in that part of the challenge.

So whose fault was it that despite the huge lead they had going in,
they still couldn't get the puzzle together in time?

Joel is MOST at fault because Joel distracted his tribe's puzzle solvers so
much that they lost. Ask Ozzy if you don't believe me. He was there to see
it all.

And Mongo had to be looking ahead to where the opposing players
were going if he and Chet had any hope of catching them, so it was
Chet's responsibility to keep up and let Mongo know if he had fallen.

Are you really claiming that Chet failed to let Joel know he had fallen
and that that is why Joel acted the way he did?

He might have but I didn't hear Chet say anything during the entire
challenge.

Wow. Your ability to displace blame is amazing. The rope was only about 3
feet long. No matter how muscular Joel is (and his inability to hold up a
fish as well as Amanda speaks to his actual strength) there is no way that
he is so strong that he didn't notice when the rope was taut. In fact,
there is no way to yell out 'I have fallen' befor ethe rope would be taut,
so your attempt to blame Chet for not relaying the message to Joel orally is
nonsensical.

I am claiming that a person that refuses to swim can't complain about how
poorly someone else does it.

Of course they can, we do it here all the time

We were not given the opportunity to swim, so we can not be blamed for the
lack of good swimming that existed in the swimming portion of the
challenges. However, every person that is actually in the challenge and is
afraid to swim, has no business whining about how the person that was chosen
to swim did poorly. The only person with a right to whine is the one that
would have been a better swimmer, but was not picked to swim because Chet
volunteered (even though they wanted and also volunteered for that swimming
role).

I'd call him directly responsible for the swimming loss (but I don't
credit Joel for doing any better there since he avoids the water
altogether).

That Mongo didn't swim is irrelevant

No it isn't. Joel contributed exactly zero to the challenge. You can't
give Joel any credit for anything he has not done. Standing there screaming
'swim faster' is not contribution.

I give Joel no significant credit for the lead his team had in that
challenge since Joel missed every single time he threw at the target.

And the other players missed also.

No. Other players hit the targets, otherwise the targets would not have
been broken. Joel DID NOT hit the targets, so Joel contributed nothing to
the breaking of targets. Since the targets were broken, it should be clear
that OTHER players did contribute. Why you think Joel deserves any credit
in the challenge for missing every time is beyond me.

Like I said the editing was for ***, but how did Mongo end up with two
sacks and why didn't the other tribe try to get them from him?

He was, therefore, not anywhere near as useful as James.

And what was Mr.Furley's contribution during this challenge?

The same as Joel's contribution towards breaking targets or swimming.
Exactly zero.
BTW, I just rewatched the bag grabbing challenge. Joel is only shown three
times. Once, he attacks Amanda to take a bag from here. Once, he attacks
Cirie to take a bag from her. From then on, he is only shown sitting in his
endzone guarding bags and doing nothing to contribute to any progress for
his team.

Fair enough. The point at which it was brought up was as a way of
listing where Joel has been useful in winning challenges.

And where he might be useful in future challenges, unlike Chet who
has shown himself to be utterly useless in everything he does (well,
he probably feeds the chickens real good....)

I agree that Joel has more potential to be useful that Chet. That does not
change at all that Joel has not been particularly useful so far or that he
was completely useless in both of the challenges in the last episode.

Even if that were the case, it's still more then Chet has done and more
importantly, the players don't know what kinda challenges will be
coming up.

True. The next challenge could be a game of concentration or a paint an SOS
signal on the beach type challenge where Chet would be of more use than
Joel.

Joel can't swim.

We haven't _seen_ Mongo swim but we _know_ Mr.Furley can't.

True, we haven't seen Joel swim. So, his muscularity has contributed
exactly zero to the physical portion of the swimming challenges. You know
as well as I do that if he had anything to offer as a swimmer, he would have
been swimming.

Mr.Furley can't solve a puzzle even when looking down on it from
the platform but Mongo, standing on the ground off to the side, could
see the pattern.

Joel was yelling that a pattern existed. The response is: well duh, Joel.
Joel was not helping to solve the puzzle, he was inhibiting his tribes
communication.


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