Re: S.F. Zoo's history of mismanagement


"chatnoir" <wolfbat359a@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Dec 30, 10:52 pm, "JonesieCat" <Long Ago@Far Away> wrote:
"chatnoir" <wolfbat3...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

news:e2467374-4619-48a5-a50d-da16bef7e672@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On Dec 30, 6:58 pm, "JonesieCat" <Long Ago@Far Away> wrote:



There also may have been a culture of taunting animals that arrose
around the zoo!

http://www.expertclick.com/NewsReleaseWire/default.cfm?Action=Release...

Solution fortigerattack in San Francisco

Dallas, TX 75230 December 30 2007

Samson and me

The tragic accident at the San Francisco zoo was most likely
precipitated by agitation on the part of visitors. The cat had to have
had motivation to decide to leap out of the enclosure and focus on
specific visitors.

This reaction to taunting and teasing on the part of the public has
caused other incidents at other facilities, however none of them have
led to the death of visitors before. Therefore, they have been
overlooked.

I have been advocating for some years that docents/volunteers be
stationed at specific key points in zoos and other facilities that
display wild animals. They should be particularly placed near
enclosures that house big cats, primates, bears, and other potentially
dangerous, sensitive, and intelligent animals that will forcefully
react to agitation.

It should be a quick and simple solution to reactions such as that at
the San Francisco zoo. It could be implemented quickly, and it would
give the public immediate reassurance that changes were being made.
The docents would keep any visitors from in any way agitating the
animals without ruining the appropriate positive experience visitors
should enjoy.

Additionally, the reinforced lack of such taunting would give the
animals housed at the zoo a much better quality of life and relieve
their stress level. It would also help teach the public that respect
for wild animals is a preferable way to share an experience with them.

Louis Dorfman (louisdorf...@xxxxxxx)
Animal Behaviorist
International Exotic Animal Sanctuary
9909 Preston Road
Dallas, TX 75230
Phone : 214 696-4425
Fax : 214-696-1758
=======================

This seems like a reasonable and do-able solution - for zoos everywhere.
Art
museums have volunteers (I assume) standing around preventing damage to
paintings, wouldn't common sense say the same caution and protection
would
be required of living beings?? Hope this Dorfman person gets listened
to.

As for the taunting, yes, take some action to prohibit/diminish it, by
all
means. But in this particular incident, and thetigerheading for the
cafe... and, well - it's a CAFE for Gawd's sake.

Was it not following the blood trail and smell of its tormentors?

How long you think

Tatiana-the-Tiger'sbeen smelling those burgers?! I doubt taunting had
anything to do with anything by the time she got there. Seriously.

jc

No, he attacked one of the brothers! Seems to me you want to hire
these brothers as you babysitter!

============================
She attacked when she had the opp to attack, you wingnut, right near her
enclosure, as well as later on, after she neared the cafe. (And no, she
did
not need a blood trail to get there, you braniac.) Big cats attack because
they CAN. Just because the police used the trail of blood doesn't mean
Tatianna needed it! You think she had a magnifying glass and a trench coat
too? Or perhaps a gold shield and a blue uniform as she investigated the
path she wanted to take? Tatianna followed her nose as she'd do in the
wild - right to food. And, yes, dinner was waiting, tho it wound up not to
be burgers she got from the cafe after all. As for the brothers? I know
nothing about them and need to know nothing. It would be somewhat amusing
to
learn they indeed lured her out of her enclosure however. Pls post the
confession, or photos and eyewitness statements, will you?

jc

http://uplinktruck.livejournal.com/217894.html

excerpt:

We also know the tiger specifically tracked those three men ignoring
others until the police tried to intervene. Being recently fed, we
know the tiger was not hungry. For the cat to specifically track these
three men down while ignoring other possibilities leads me to believe
(speculate) there is more to this then a random feline temper tantrum.
There is a report that one of the men may have sat with his feet
dangling over the tiger's side of the wall. But lacking eye witnesses
or surveillance I suspect we will never know that part of the equation
for sure. ...

http://bigcatescapesmaulings.blogspot.com/2007/12/did-this-tiger-hold-grudge.html

headline:

Did This Tiger Hold a Grudge?

Did This Tiger Hold a Grudge?

Friday, Dec. 28, 2007 By ALEXANDRA SILVER

The Siberian tiger that killed Carlos Sousa Jr., 17, and mauled two
other men, brothers Paul Dhaliwal, 19, and Kulbir Dhaliwal, 23, at the
San Francisco Zoo on Christmas Day, has sparked a police investigation
and much speculation as to who is to blame. Authorities are still
investigating how the animal escaped -- recent reports indicate she
could have jumped or scaled the enclosure's wall, which is nearly 4
ft. lower than the recommended standard -- and whether or not the
victims taunted her before the attacks.


However uncertain the preceding circumstances, the facts of the
assault are clearer: Just before the zoo's closing time, the 4-year-
old tiger named Tatiana escaped her pen and attacked the older of the
Dhaliwal brothers, then turned on and killed Sousa, who was apparently
trying to save his friend by distracting the animal. She then made her
way 300 yards to the zoo café, following a trail of blood left by the
first injured man who had fled with his brother. It was there she
attacked her third victim, the younger Dhaliwal, and was shot dead by
police officers -- 20 minutes after they had received the call that the
tiger was loose.

So, what exactly was Tatiana's motive? It may well be that she,
despite being born into captivity and identified with a human name,
was simply being a tiger -- acting as any other predator would in
nature. It's no surprise that tigers can be aggressive. But is it
possible that Tatiana may have remembered the three men -- who may have
taunted her -- and set out for them specifically? Was she, in other
words, holding a grudge?

"That tiger could have been surrounded by 10,000 people," says Dave
Salmoni, the Animal Planet network's predator expert, who spent years
training big cats; but if the animal has a mission, "it will avoid all
of those people and just to go to those three people." Says Salmoni,
"There's nothing more focused than a tiger who wants to kill
something." The thing is, though, it's not easy to prompt such enmity:
"To get a tiger to want to fight you is pretty hard," says Salmoni.
"Tigers don't like to fight. They hunt to kill and eat. That's it."
Unlike lions, which grow up in groups and are used to sparring, tigers
are solitary animals,
responsible for their own food and survival, Salmoni says. They will
take the risk to fight only "if they feel they have to."

The gap between Tatiana's attacks on the men at the San Francisco Zoo
was relatively brief, so the word "grudge," which implies ill will
that persists over time, may not be appropriate in this situation.
Perhaps Tatiana's behavior would more accurately be described as a
crime of passion -- no grudge necessary. Still, could years of
captivity have led to harbored resentment against humans, and her
eventual attack?

Citing Tatiana's so-called history of violence -- her assault just over
a year ago on a zookeeper during a feeding -- Salmoni says, "It may
hold what we call a grudge on people." Tatiana wasn't put down then
because the zoo director had determined that the tiger was acting as a
normal tiger does.

Captive animals have acted violently before. In 2006 an orca (a.k.a.
killer whale) at SeaWorld in San Diego attacked its trainer, who
survived. That summer an elephant killed its handler at the Elephant
Sanctuary in Tennessee. In 2004 a gorilla at the Dallas Zoo went on a
rampage, injuring four people. A white tiger critically hurt
illusionist Roy Horn, half of the performing duo Siegfried & Roy, at
the Mirage Hotel-Casino in Las Vegas in 2003. More recently, in
February 2007, a jaguar at the Denver Zoo killed a keeper. Despite
these, among other dramatic attacks, some people wonder why they don't
happen more often. Salmoni suggests it's because animals are actually
"very forgiving," and that the stories we hear are the exceptions. So,
are those exceptions evidence that animals bear grudges?

It's controversial, but some experts believe it's possible. "There's a
difference between what we know anecdotally and what we can prove,"
says Salmoni. Most people who work with animals, he says, would agree
that they act on past experience. True, what we refer to as a grudge
might more accurately be characterized, in the animal world, as
conditional reinforcement. "Any animal that can be trained can
remember, and if you can remember, you can hold a grudge," says
Salmoni. If a 6-ft.-tall man once threw rocks at a puppy, that puppy
could be conditioned to believe, later in life, that another 6-ft.-
tall man is a threat, and may attack him. ...

==========================
Look, the opinions of these writers you just posted are not "evidence"
which supports your own opinion. You know that right? In fact, there is much
speculation in the above disputing same. But in any case, I am appreciative
of your posting these. Because they're way interesting, and I enjoyed
reading them. Fact is, nobody knows why big cats or orcas etc do what they
do and everyone =can= only 'speculate', as one of the writers says. (As we
do here in atc about this and so much else! hahaha!) I remember when that
orca (referenced above) attacked his trainer too, oooo. Very vivid memory of
the replay on tv - and incredibly the trainer calmed him down, so skilled -
the whale wouldn't allow him to get out of the water, kept tossing him
around - incredible - it was speculated at the time that it was because
he(?), the whale, was coming into maturity - hormone problems if you will?!
That's what I recall anyway. I love animals. Not so different from us.

jc


.

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