Re: She's Hot Looking And Oh So VERY Dirty


My name is really Nancy, but Denise is fine too (unless you meant Choc)! This posting is in response to both your sharing more details about your situations (Thanks). I realize I sound nosy sometimes.

Wow, what a struggle. I am amazed by how some kids "make it" despite the odds against them, and the other kids born with all the benefits in the world still have trouble keeping it together. I know that is a huge generalization and lots of kids born with trouble end up all messed up (if they even survive), and that lots of silver-spooner kids make good. It is just that I am really impressed by those who beat the odds. In a teeny tiny way I see it now with my kittens I foster - the runt was *very* weak, body all limp, he really looked dead a couple times, I was thinking he'd die for sure after the first day or three, or that I would have to tube-feed him. But no, even tho only two teats were working on mama (I did a lot of bottle feeding for this litter, but he *hated* the bottle) he perservered, and now, at just 1/2 the size of his peers, seems to be the strongest one (he routinely seems to "beat" his littermates in play fighting (he seems to dominate most times), he was the first to eat from a saucer, the first to eat solid food, the first to poop in the litter box...). Not trying to minimalize your horrendous situation by comparing it to a litter of kittens, it is just the ability to overcome that I am noting.

I am messy but I don't have any excuse - my mom was a pretty good housekeeper. We had pets but all their waste was properly deposited in the yard or whatever. My messiness is more about too many books, movies, computer paraphernalia, games (I <heart> my Wii), and papers all over on whatever subjects have me presently obsessed (which reminds me of neopets - you still playing?), along with workout stuff (weights, bands, mats, etc). I keep atop animal issues and at this stage of my life hire a professional to once monthly clean this place but good.

Glad you made it thru - I recall some of your other postings about the horrible *** done to you as a kid by your dad. I am amazed you're relatively normal despite it! I only say "relatively" because I don't know anyone completely normal; don't even know for sure what "normal" is...

Hope you and everyone had a great Thanksgiving :-)




Ruthless wrote:
Hey Denise,

I can't speak for her, but I grew up in a house just like Choc's and the
one depicted in the original article, and I'll answer your questions.

Is she still around?

Yes. She's happily widowed and living with a man who replaced my father
within a few weeks. He's a scumbag too, but on a much lesser scale than my
father was.

Do you have any follow-up information about how she eventually came
around (or didn't)?

I don't think my mother was as severely depressed as Choc's. She would get
out of bed. She was always able to hold down a job. She went to parties
with my father, and would sometimes get motivated enough to ride our asses
into cleaning the house in order to have her own parties. She never just
laid in bed. She read compulsively, did jigsaw puzzles, made our clothes,
worked part-time on her own to design and make wedding dresses. I don't
know how she was able to keep customers, because people had to come
through our house to do fittings and such, but she did. She also sometimes
worked as a private baker, designing cakes for parties and weddings.
Today, as an adult with somewhat of a clue, I wouldn't eat anything that
was cooked in that filthy kitchen. If you walk into a house and have to
watch the floor to avoid stepping in dog***, why the HELL would you want
to EAT something from there?

But when I went down for my father's deathwatch, her house was reasonably
clean. There was a lot of stuff piled on the counters, and rooms that
weren't used regularly had quite a lot of dust, but there was no animal
*** or piss on the floor, no rotting crap shoved under cushions and
furniture or in cubbies. The dirty dishes by the sink had been rinsed and
were more-or-less neatly stacked. I think once we all left home, she felt
able to keep things somewhat under control, and managed to get into the
habit.

Do you have siblings?

Yes. I had 3 brothers and one sister. We also had half-sibs who came into
the home with their mothers on a regular basis. My father had a habit of
bringing home "second wives" with their kids when he got them knocked up.
Very few of them lasted more than a year, but there were at least five
that I can recall right now.

My older brother (born in 1956) didn't grow up with us. He came to live
with us when he was in his teens. He was Jewish, so when he came to live
with us, we started celebrating Jewish Holidays. He wasn't my mother's
son, but he loved her on Dad's behalf and he totally worshipped my father.
He got his GED when he was 18, joined the army, and eventually bacame a
police officer (to make my father proud... my father was always a classic
wannabe-cop). He ultimately committed suicide when he was 44 years old. I
don't know a lot about how he lived as an adult, although I know he went
through three marriages (no kids) and never owned a home, and I know he
never had any pets.

My immediate younger brother (born in 1962) dropped out of High School,
picked up his GED and joined the Air Force so he could marry at 17. He
divorced when he was 22 and remarried his second wife a few years later.
He's happily married to her and has a total of 4 kids, 3 with his 1st wife
and one with his second. He's a millionaire, possibly a multi-millionaire.
He's a neat-n-clean freak, never had any pets, a control freak,
frighteningly intelligent, and up until the last few years, horribly
egomaniacal. When we were at my father's deathwatch, he showed a major
personality change... he seemed to actually have some humility and
empathy, traits I never saw him display throughout our childhoods or young
adulthoods. I asked him what the hell had humbled him and he said, "I met
some people smarter than me." He wouldn't go into more detail than that.

My baby brother (born in 1964) was a drug addict who got clean in a
12-step program about 15 years ago. He married an emotionally powerful
(controlling, I suppose), not-too-bright, morbidly obese Southern Baptist
woman right out of High School (well, she was fresh out of High School; he
didn't graduate). I don't believe he ever bothered to get his GED. He has
a quiet, accepting, very sweet personality. He's worked as a labourer all
his life. His wife is a low-level office worker. They do fairly well
financially. They'll never be "rich" but they own their own home and they
manage to make ends meet; they handle their money well. They've had two
children and they have about six dogs and a couple of cats. Their home is
extremely messy and sometimes a bit dirty, but nothing like the home we
grew up in. They live as brother and sister now. They both have lovers and
are both aware of each other's lovers, but they seem happy to stay
married. They clearly enjoy each other's company and like each other very
much. And they're very solid and loving parents.

My baby sister (born in 1966) is the only one of us who graduated from
High School. She immediately went to University, got a 4-year nursing
degree, and ultimately became an Opthalmic nurse. She married during
University, had two kids after graduation, divorced in her mid-twenties,
and remained single to raise her children. They are both in college now
and she is engaged. She's owned her own home since she was 25 years old.
She's never had any pets. She's a devout Catholic and keeps a slightly
messy but clean home. Throughout her adult life, she's maintained a very
middle-class persona. I don't know if it's real or not... only that it's
very foreign to me. As a young adult, she tended to be extremely
judgemental, but after a breakdown in her mid-30s, she eased up some.
She's actually sort of fun to be around.

I was born in 1960. I left home at 13, didn't finish high school, picked
up my GED when I was 17 (mostly on a whim). I did a lot of drugs from
puberty until I got pregnant with my first surviving child. I married at
22 and went through a hellish divorce at 28. I then entered a fantastic
4-year live-in relationship that ended well and remarried 11 years ago to
a man I respect and adore and love beyond words. I'm terrible with money.
We bought a home when my husband was making exceptionally good money, but
lost it in less than a year with the dot.com Crash. I doubt we'll ever own
another home. I'm a terrible housekeeper, but my house has never been in
the state that my mother's house was. I'm a little dirty and a lot messy.
Up until my brother killed himself, my primary mood was low-level
depression with occasional bouts of hellish black suicidal ideation and
even rarer bouts of almost manic highs. The only things I was able to
consistently enjoy was parenting and taking care of critters. I always
loved being a mom. Most of my life, I've either worked as a Vet Tech or
with Severely Emotionally Disturbed Children. I've always had lots of
pets. I honestly believed that I would probably kill myself when I hit
empty nest syndrome, and can remember trying to figure out what I was
going to do with my animals before I offed myself. I was only able to
change my outlook on life after my brother died. I don't think I've
actually been depressed since about a month after he shot himself. My nest
finally emptied 5 months ago and I'm still happy, so I guess I was wrong
about my ending.

Were you subject to CPS or anything like that?

I called DFYS a couple of times when I was 11 or 12 and asked them to put
us in a foster home. I don't believe those calls were ever investigated.
DFYS got involved in our family when my baby sister was 13 years old and
admitted to me that our father was raping her. By then my baby brother was
in Juvi for some drug-related thing and the rest of us were long gone. My
father copped a plea to contributing to the delinquency of a minor and was
put on probation for 5 years. He wasn't allowed contact with my sister for
a couple of those years. Supposedly he got treatment. I know he never
actually touched her again, but he never learned not to be an *** with
his mouth. He couldn't carry on a conversation with any female without
sexually harrassing her. He died almost three years ago. The world is a
cleaner place on that count alone.

What I mostly remember about living in filth was realizing that we
*stunk*. I walked into my classroom one day when I was in the fourth grade
(9 years old) and saw a couple of kids wrinkle their noses as I walked
by... recognized that they could literally smell the stink on me. By that
time, all the housework was primarily my responsibility (I was, after all,
the oldest girl...) and I actually started trying to do it. Rather than
hide everything under furniture, I'd pick up the *** and scrub the pee,
try to rinse dishes before they were stacked, try to put clean clothes
where animals wouldn't *** on them, try to get the garbage into bags and
out on the curb on time for pickup, beat up my brothers and my sister to
make them help me clean house after school. I had to spend my Saturdays at
the laundromat, and was expected to clean the house and feed the kids
after school during the week. Sundays were a joy because even when my
parents weren't willing to go to Mass, they would get up and take us and
drop us off at Church if we asked. I loved going to Mass. After Mass, we'd
go over to my best friend's clean and stable house and watch television
and have Sunday dinner. We didn't have a television, and we didn't have
Sunday Dinners. Sundays became my favorite day from the beginning of fifth
grade until I left home after the 8th grade.

Davi
--
People are like diamonds. They have many facets.
.