Re: Burgravius [understand: B(o)urgrave, Burggraf] - most famous the one "of Nuremberg" (Nürenberg)

On Nov 11, 9:31 pm, François R. Velde <ve...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
In medio alt.talk.royalty aperuit David <ds...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> os suum:



On Nov 11, 11:45 am, François R. Velde <ve...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
In medio alt.talk.royalty aperuit David <ds...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> os suum:

On Nov 11, 7:54 am, "edespal...@xxxxxxxx" <edespal...@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
one encounters "burgravius", in: Valentin Ferdinand Gvdenvs, Sylloge
I, 1728,p496 [London, British Library, shelfmak : 594.c.12. Request],
it seems the opus can be read online (numeritized, digitalisized) via
the Library of the University of Heidelberg (Germany). In those days
the title sylloge was not rare, what it precisely means is not known.
Of course Burggraf was probably also translated otherwise (using
castrum/castle and comes/count?).

I've never seen such a translation, just "Burggravius". Likewise,
Markgraf always = Marchio (and occasionally Marggravius), but not
"comes finium" or "comes limitum".

See Du Cange's Glossarium, vol. 3 p. 424-426 for examples: comes castrensis,
comes castri, comes limitum, comes limitanei (also in a late Antiquity context),
comes marcarum.
--
François Velde
ve...@xxxxxxxxxx (replace by "heraldica")
Heraldry Site:http://www.heraldica.org/

But are those *equivalents* for the titles (which might be used in
place of Burggravius or Marchio) or are they *glosses* on the titles
(to explain what they mean in the original German)?

You are free to track down the reference.

As you were free to answer my question, as someone who presumably had
the reference in hand! (And in any case your reference is defective.)

You said you had never seen such a
*translation*, now you have.

No, I haven't, still. There *is* a difference between a gloss, a
definition, an etymology, and a translation. And while a word like
"Markgraf" can be etymologized as "Count of the Borderland", one is
hardly justified in _translating_ "Markgraf von Brandenburg" as "Count
of the Borderland of Brandenburg". Likewise, that a "Glossary" may
define "Marchio" as "comes limitum" doesn't necessarily imply that
it's licit to write "Comes limitum Brandenburgensis".

.

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