Re: Future Mets Manager

On Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:26 -0700, jonathan wrote:

On Jun 20, 4:23 pm, Ruben <ru...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:38:10 -0700, jonathan wrote:
On Jun 20, 2:32 am, Ruben <ru...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
With the fall out, the team will be examining new manager choices
going into next season.

My short list includes the following:

Cookie Rojas

He's 69 years old and has exactly 155 games of Major League Managerial
experience. I know you like you players young, but apparently you
like your managers old.

I also consider Frank Robinson but eliminate him based on age. I don't
think 69 is so old, but I was very impressed with Rojas as a coach on
the Mets. He's not a maniac, but is still capable of wearing his
emotions on his sleaves and he has an incredible desire to win. He has
that Keith Hernandez quality, the edge to win, a natural winner, and
perhaps a great tactican. And he is also potentially a fine fine voice
for the club, which is an aspect of the job which is overlooked.


You have no idea of any of these things. You weren't in the clubhouse.
What do you know of his 'incredible desire to win'? Is it because he got
into one shoving match with Charlie Williams in a playoff game? As usual,
are you basing an entire argument on one incident?

No just one event, but after watching him for a few years.




Wally Backman

It's been discussed. Obivously, he seems like a guy who can motivate.
I doubt anybody can speak to him strategically, but he was a smart
player.
Of course, so was Willie Randolph. The facts are though, that unless
you know his past problems are behind him, you're probably signing up
for a whole legion of controversy, which this team doesn't need any
more of.

I believe that if they want to win, that Backman is their man. I also
believe that his past and problems are overstated. Backman has proven
that he can move players into win. I think he can be Lasorda like as a
mouthpiece. They real drawback, IMO, he is a cancer survivor. It would
suck for a relapse mid-season.

Ok, wait a second. You hate Ryan Church because he made one completely
stupid and ignorant remark, but you think Backman's problems, which
include domestic violence, a DUI, and bankruptcy because of debt owed to
over 20 creditors including the IRS are 'overstated'? Ruben, I honestly
cannot figure you out sometimes . . .


Church's remark was a virulently anti-semetic remark which echos centurys
of violent and deadly persecution.

Backman fought cancer and survived. He had problems with his wife, and
debt? How do you compare these. Dept is not a crime. Domestic violence
is almost always overblown and a two way street of abuse symtamatic of a
bad marraige. And he's in trouble with the IRS. Gee, have you ever seen
these three things before in tangent? It sounds like quite a few cancer
victems to me, who end up broke paying for treatments. He's not am
alcoholic like Martin, or a drug abuser like Steve Howe.

Really, it takes a twisted mind to think that getting into debt and
having a bad marraige is some measure of a person's moral character.

Meanwhile, players play for him. So he must know something about people
and baseball, something worthwhile.






Ken Oberkfeld

I'm a fan. He's managed in the minors forever, and by all accounts
guys like playing for him.

I think that secondary to losing Peterson, Oberkfeld is the most assute
pitching expert that the Mets have available and can add an
organizational dimension to scouting and talent assesment. I don't
believe that Miniya and Oberkfeld can work together than have a history
of conflict.


Huh? OBERKFELL was an infielder. What the hell does he know about
pitching? I agree he's a good candidate to be the manager, but to make
him an 'astute pitching expert' is a bit of a stretch.


He was in charge of the minor league pitching program and scouting until
Peterson was put in charge of it. In fact, he had some public comments
on the new direction of the entire minor league operations after losing
his grip on the program.



Ron Gardenhier

Good luck with that. Why would he EVER leave the Twins?

Plain cold cash and a sense of history with the organnzation.


What history? He spent six years in the Mets system. He's been in the
Twins system for TWENTY years, including being with the major league
club since 1991. Obviously if he wanted to be somewhere else, he'd have
done it by now.

He's been
there forever, and Tom Kelly was his mentor.

Bud Harrelson

You're serious? He's 64. He also was a lousy manager. The best
thing going for him was he wasn't Davey Johnson on a team that had
tuned Davey out. That had more to do with his success that first
year then anything else.

I don't necessarly believe that. I believe his teams were over
estimated, and I'd always felt he deserved more of a chance.


Huh? He inherited a team that had averaged 95.8 wins over the previous
six years under Davey Johnson. The day he took over, the Mets were
20-22.
They lost that night to Tom Browning and Reds. His 'brilliance' was
that
he started playing Dave Magadan, who had the year of his life, and
Darryl Strawberry started to hit. It wasn't exactly rocket science.


He seemed to do alright, and just got fed up with the organization. The
collapse of the Mets wasn't Buddy's fault. They continued in free fall
long after he left.

Meanwhile his independent leugue seems to operate just fine.


Buck Showalter

I think Buck's act is a little tired. Of course, I thought the same
thing about Tom Coughlin. You've had worse ideas.

The guy knows how to execute on a plan.


He's also a jerk who's players have quit for before. Do you think it's
a coincidence that twice his teams have won World Series the year AFTER
he left?


Maybe, and he also drove the teams to success from failure. That also
speaks for itself.


BTW - do you have other suggestions? Or is this just a dart throwing
contest?

Clint Hurdle

Based on what?

Mind you, not that much.

The guy is a career loser, except for his team getting hot for 30
games last year.

That was RED HOT, one of the most amaizing runs I'd ever witnessed.


It was 30 games. That's like saying Jerry Manuel should get the job
fulltime because the Mets have won 2 out of 3.

He's managed over 1,000 games in the
majors, and has almost no success to show for it.

So did Joe Torre.


Not true. Torre managed 709 games for the Mets. Everybody agrees those
were aweful teams of virtually no talent. In both Atlanta and St. Louis
Torre had consistently winning records. Nobody could have though what
happened with the Yankees would happen, but there was reason to believe
he would be competitive and win, because he had done so in Atlanta and
St. Louis. Other then last year, Hurdle has never had a winning record.
Torre had five winning seasons before coming to the Yankees.

Mike Scioscia

See Gardenhire. Why would he ever leave the Angels?

Money


Money is why he would stay. Do you really think Arte Moreno would allow
someone to outbid him for his manager?

Ray Knight

See Randolph, Willie. He's already proven he has no idea how to
manage a majorleague baseball team. You have to be more then just
'fiery'. You also have to know what you're doing. Getting a fiery
version of Willie Randolph doesn't help anything.

I admitedy was drawing straws here.

Ruben





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--http://www.mrbrklyn.com- Interesting Stuffhttp://www.nylxs.com-
Leadership Development in Free Software

So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn,
like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the
world - RI Safir 1998

http://fairuse.nylxs.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI
Safir 2002

"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"

"The tremendous problem we face is that we are becoming sharecroppers
to our own cultural heritage -- we need the ability to participate in
our own society."

"> I'm an engineer. I choose the best tool for the job, politics be
damned.< You must be a stupid engineer then, because politcs and
technology have been attached at the hip since the 1st dynasty in
Ancient Egypt. I guess you missed that one."

© Copyright for the Digital Millennium

--
http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Interesting Stuff
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software

So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998

http://fairuse.nylxs.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002

"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"

"The tremendous problem we face is that we are becoming sharecroppers to our own cultural heritage -- we need the ability to participate in our own society."

"> I'm an engineer. I choose the best tool for the job, politics be damned.<
You must be a stupid engineer then, because politcs and technology have been attached at the hip since the 1st dynasty in Ancient Egypt. I guess you missed that one."

© Copyright for the Digital Millennium

.

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