Re: Beckett goes from #1 to #4

On Thu, 27 Jan 2011 09:54:53 -0500, "Dano" <janeanddano@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:


"nate" <greystone@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:0340489f-eecb-4e78-aa63-245ac9f5088a@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On Jan 26, 10:01 pm, Gary <golfera...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
26074968On Wed, 26 Jan 2011 19:06:20 -0500, "Ray O'Hara"
<raymond-oh...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"Larsfan" <srgntbi...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:15c842e4-9276-4e34-bb6c-2a95952872c7@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Looks like the Sox will start it off with Lester, Buchholtz, Lackey -
and then Beckett and Dice K as #4 and 5.

they all get to pitch.
this "he's number 1, no HE'S number 1 is really pointless.

Not to mention that Beckett will most likely start game 3, not 4.


This does (thus far) put out in stark relief the failure of the front
office to address this problem. The MFY didn't stand pat, did they?
And didn't they finish ahead of the Sox, was it??? (voice trails
off....)


What did the MFY do to address their own starting pitching issues? Their #2
had to be considered Phil Hughes (4.19 ERA...11.42 LCS) right? He was
barely better than Lackey, who I guess you considered a massive failure with
an ERA a few points higher. After him they have AJ with his tidy 5.26 ERA
(7.50 post season).

Jenks?

AL pitching BF OI BG AdjOPS
JoaquinBenoit TBR 221 180 65 .361
MarianoRivera NYY 238 179 72 .402
RafaelSoriano TBR 240 189 79 .418
.
.
.
Jenks didnt even make the list! The MFY get the #3 guy to go with
Mariano. Theo gets Jenks.

Yeah. They grabbed a second closer when they really needed a starter.



THEN we get to the Starting Pitching, Problem #2? Theo does
*Nothing*. He has 2 starters in the toughest division. 2. Then it's
whale dreck.

Two of the top starters in baseball. And you consider yourself a stat guy
and call Lackey, Beckett and Matsuzaka "whale dreck"? Come on Nate. Pull
your head out. Come back to us. Over here. In the real world. No one is
saying any of those three are going to be in consideration for the Cy. But
they are still pretty decent pitchers. Beckett had a horrible year. No
question. He was also hurt much of the year. I'm betting he bounces back.
He and Lackey appear to be badly overpaid now. I still like our guys better
than the Yanks 3-5 pitchers.


THEN we get to the Catching. Perhaps some purists would say this was
the #1 Problem instead of Relief pitching or Starting Pitching. They
let V-Mart walk. This is WORSE than *nothing*. Salted Schrod!
Salted Schrod! Let's give the Inspector General Theo some more of
that Salted Schrod.

"Schrod"? WTF is THAT? Seriously? You think Victor was an excellent
catcher? He was a very good hitter. As a catcher he leaves a bit to be
desired really. As evidenced by the fact that Detroit primarily wanted him
as a hitter. The Sox made up for the loss of his bat very well I think. It
certainly remains to be seen if Salty will be the long term solution behind
the plate. Cost and risk seems very low to me. If he handles the job
defensively, any offense is gravy. If he doesn't...they will replace him
and move on. This team is loaded enough offensively to make up the loss
other ways. I think it's a fairly safe bet he'll be a better "catcher" than
V-Mart.



They had the BEST 1st baseman in all of 2011 baseball. What do they
do? They get Gonzalez and move Youk to 3rd where he is still probably
good, but just not as good as at 1st. Perhaps the read on Beltre is
Truth and he will will suck now that he has the money again, like he
did before. Theo has to be praying it is so.

All round I think Gonzo is an even better first baseman. All around, I
think Youk will prove to be an even better third baseman than Beltre.
Beltre had his second best career year. Unlikely he would have come close
to duplicating that. Was never the plan anyway.


They have the aging Cameron & other various whale dreck in the form of
a few very valiant energetic whoopdeedoos at left and now they score
the amazing Carl Crawford. YES. Move Jacoby back to Center where, if
you have correctly assessed he lack of ability, Carl can save the day
coming over to cut off those wall-banging alleys. But mostly back to
where Jacoby flourishes at the plate. Carl is the best left fielder
in the game.

Grades so far: C+ for Jenks. F for Starters. F- for Catchers. B
for the conservation of Adrian count on the team. A+ for Crawford.
Total thus far: D

F for starters? Good grief. I don't even know what to say to that. What
did you expect them to do? They have two top ten starters in my estimation.
The other guys? They are pretty much married to them with only the hope
that they improve over last year. They have a couple of young arms still
waiting to break in...Doubront and Bowden. Only Beckett had what I think
can be considered a disastrous year for back half of the rotation starters
if you look at this realistically. Again. He was hurt. So how do you make
a trade given all of that? Funny thing how the thing nearly everyone in
baseball deemed to be a great strength is now such I disaster in your eyes
after one off year.

I don't see how you can give anything but an "incomplete" for catcher.
Obviously they're rolling the dice on Salty. Not a bad gamble in my mind.
If it bombs, they can replace him with the best defender from the minors and
be fine if it comes to that. There were no real answers in the market that
looked enticing to me.

I'd give them a B for relief help since (as WB pointed out) you left out
Wheeler. That gives them Pap, Bard, Jenks and Wheeler so far as almost
certain with a good field of candidates to round out the rest. I'd rate
that at least a B. Could end up an A when we see it pan out in camp.


SO FAR I AM VERY PISSED!!!!


You have really lost all sense of proportion Nate. Climb carefully back in
off that limb will ya?


Nate is off the wall. Exactly what did Nate expect the Sox do with
Beckett and Lackey, release them?

As for 1b, with all due respect to Youk, Gonzo might be the best 1b in
the league and Youk will be very good at third.

The outfield defense has improved and the defense at catcher is
improved, in my opinion. Even if Salty doesn't hit, the defense is
better and they made up VMart's offense. If they signed Vmart, they
wouldn't have both Crawford and Gonzo and still wouldn't have Beltre.

Unlike Nate, most baseball observers believe the Sox had a great
off-season.
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Beckett goes from #1 to #4
    ... Not to mention that Beckett will most likely start game 3, ... He was barely better than Lackey, who I guess you considered a massive failure with an ERA a few points higher. ... He has 2 starters in the toughest division. ... As a catcher he leaves a bit to be desired really. ...
    (alt.sports.baseball.bos-redsox)
  • Re: Beckett goes from #1 to #4
    ... and then Beckett and Dice K as #4 and 5. ...  As a catcher he leaves a bit to be ... the amazing Carl Crawford. ... The outfield defense has improved and the defense at catcher is ...
    (alt.sports.baseball.bos-redsox)
  • Re: And #4 starter is settling in
    ... Beckett still has the better control too. ... Buchholz did have great 2010. ... Each of the Red Sox 5 starters has the ability to win 17 ... Clemens did it 8 times during his career. ...
    (alt.sports.baseball.bos-redsox)
  • Re: Will Boston trade for Beckett?
    ... >>I'd take 2 mediocrities off somebody's hands to get a Beckett. ... >>> Beckett is likely an improvement over each of our starters ... Still, dumping prospects was allegedly NOT the plan, ... Hanley will never be good or even very good, ...
    (alt.sports.baseball.bos-redsox)
  • Re: Will Boston trade for Beckett?
    ... >>> Boston and Texas fight for the deal. ... I have no interested in letting ... >> $10-$12M to the payroll for Beckett and 3B mediocrity? ... >> Beckett is likely an improvement over each of our starters ...
    (alt.sports.baseball.bos-redsox)