Re: $7.00 tolls for the tunnels


"Dano" <janeanddano@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:gfpn94$sa9$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
McDuck wrote:
On Sat, 15 Nov 2008 23:05:46 -0500, replyonusenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Nov 2008 23:05:17 -0500, "Raymond O'Hara"
<raymond-ohara@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

wow.
looks like bridge traffic will pick up.


Also looks like traffic through Everett/Revere will increase alot.

As it is I skip the bridge and tunnels. And this is before the
increase.

Is traffic in the tunnels fairly heavy? If so, then the price system
is working. (Been a while since I've used the tunnels, so I really
don't know --- just a question.)

What you want for a tunnel is solid flow at 40 mph or better, no
slowdowns. That is peak usage. If you get clogs, the carrying capacity
of the tunnel drops to 10% or less of peak. Bad use of a tunnel to
have ANY clogs even at rush hour. Now optimal pricing would have the
toll high at peak hurs and low the rest of the time if usage is not
heavy during midday, etc. Used to be hard to do, but with current
technology already in place, it is not so hard.

Now, if the point of the increase was JUST more revenue, it may be
stupid or counter-productive, as your comment suggests. We need to
know the traffic flows to know if the increase is good or bad policy.
In any even, IF the point is to control flows, then we want to have
people who value their money more than their time taking an
alternative route.

It is purely for revenue. Make no mistake about that. The officials will
even admit that. Look. traffic flows are irrelevant in this state. The
Big Dig...for all the cost...the years of construction and the disruption
we had to suffer through, has actually made the problems worse. From
today's Globe:

"A Globe analysis of state highway data documents what many motorists have
come to realize since the new Central Artery tunnels were completed: While
the Big Dig achieved its goal of freeing up highway traffic downtown, the
bottlenecks were only pushed outward, as more drivers jockey for the
limited space on the major commuting routes."

http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2008/11/16/big_dig_pushes_bottlenecks_outward/

I don't use it daily...but I have yet to see a slowdown myself in the Ted
Williams tunnel, except in cases where it backs up from route 93 or the
airport side. It flows very well. The problems are the roads that
connect...in the cases of both the O'Neill and Williams Tunnels. The
problem as I see it, is all the insane money that has been funneled into
highways, while we don't properly support and yes, subsidize, public
transportation. They seem to do everything to encourage people to drive
while making commuter rail less atractive by raising fares and just the
other day, parking fees at the rail stations. It's just insane. When
will people come to understand that subsidizing public transit is a no
brainer? No matter what you do to improve and widen highways it simply
encourages people to drive to work instead of taking the trains that
actually get you in town much faster. We pay for it all one way or the
other anyway. Jack the gas tax to properly make us drivers pay OUR
way...not just commuters who pack the trains. That seems a much more
efficient funding mechanism than lining up idling vehicles at toll booths
which is also less fair to drivers that happen to use routes that collect
tolls. Get rid of tolls and pay for this through gas and diesel taxes. I
believe we have some of the lowest in the country BTW.


Heya Dano,

While I don't really agree with you on public transit, I actually do agree
with
you on gas taxes vs tolls.

Right now, the tolls on the Mass Pike (an E-W road) are being used pay for
the Big Dig and tunnels (a N-S road).... What a total raping of the people
living to the west of Boston ... having to pay for a road that they probably
rarely
use, while the people who use the road regularly are paying zip, zero, nada!

At least when you use gas taxes, everyone is contributing to everything in a
proportion equal to their usage (and gas mileage) of the state's roads.



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