Re: Obama

On May 24, 9:55 pm, mario in victoria <mario5...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
gclark wrote:
Dano wrote:
"Gnork" <gn...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:b02dffc0-8a68-47b5-9d36-f9ef935e0e6a@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On May 24, 4:16 pm, Richard Carlisle <RCC...@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Sat, 24 May 2008 11:59:48 -0400, "Dano" <janeandd...@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

The question I and many others have is not so much was it a "very
poorly
administered war", but was it a just and legitimate war in the first
place?
What business was it of ours to intervene there from halfway around
the
world? Why do you guys continue to ignore that part of the equation?
If I am not mistaken, it was because we were asked for help by the
South Vietnamese. Initially our involvement was limited to sending
advisors. Seems to me that trying to help a nation threatened by
communism was a noble goal. John F. Kennedy got the ball rolling with
respect to advisors. If Barry Goldwater was President instead of
Lyndon Johnson, things might have worked out a bit differently.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

----
That's for sure. Barry Goldwater was a true conservative, an honorable
man, and retired as a Major General in the National Guard after having
been a pilot in WW2. He was considered a genial person and was well
liked in Congress. My uncle Gordon lived on the same block as
Goldwater in Scottsdale for a few years. He didn't know Goldwater
well, but he told me the few times they met the senator acted like a
regular guy, not a big shot. All this notwithstanding he was slimed
more viciously than any candidate ever when he ran for president. It
worked. People got he impression that a Goldwater administration would
lead to a nuclear war. He lost in a landslide.However, based on
intelligence, aptitude, world outlook and his goals of a smaller, less
intrusive government with lower taxes, he was the best presidential
candidate in memory.

If
you think it was, I'm sorry, but it does indeed indicate you are
pro-war.
How about pro-democracy. Sometimes you must go to war to defend
liberty and freedom. Unless of course you would rather avoid war at
all costs even if it means losing all the things you take for granted..

We can't and shouldn't insert ourselves into ventures like that which
don't
*directly* threaten us.
I guess Dano thinks we should not have gotten involved in the war
against Nazi Germany. After all, we were not *directly* threatened.
-------------------------------

<piggybacked>

Don't try to speak for me Carlisle, you quack. You aren't nearly smart
enough. I challenge you to find a post where I ever intimated such a
thing.
You really are an ass to compare this war to WWII. For one thing we were
supporting (and supported by) a broad coalition of free nations...not a
pathetic handful.

If anything, Bush and Company are playing the role of agressor in this
one...using similar tactics...abandoning the very principles that make
this
country of ours the "ggod guys".

That is true. The Japanese attached us, not the Germans.
---------------------------------------
And Dano probably does not think that we should have gone after
Afghanistan because they were not directly threatening us; it was Bin
Laden after all. We just should have gone in and arrested him.
------------------------------

Bullshit too. Again...you have never read anything posted by me saying
anything like that. RC...if there is anything you are famous for it's
that
you are a lying piece of crap! This administration abandoned their
pursuit
of Osama to pursue their original goal...to exact revenge on Saddam...to
show up Pop and finish the "job" he stupidly felt dad should have done.
Remember that no less than Dick Cheney himself had counseled dad on the
danger of displacing Saddam and creating a deadly power vacuum in the
region. But I'm sure these kinds of complexities are lost on you Dick.

Clinton's big failure was looking at everything as a legal or police
issue and not a war.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

---
Actually...that was one of his strong points Gnork. But then, I don't
expect you would have the intellectual capacity to realize that.

Why the insult? Makes you sound like, gasp, an elitist snob. :)

--
Glen

The events of 9/11 were much more analagous to a crime scene than a
true act
of war. Although OBL acted with the acquiescence of thiose in power in
Afghanistan...making the, morally and IMO legally culpable...therefore
making our attack there certainly justifiable...he was still no leader of
any true nation state.

Many don't realize that the world is shrinking rapidly and although it
does not seem as if terrorist countries half way around the world are
not a threat to us directly, the truth might be quite otherwise.

First they came for the homosexuals, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a homosexual;
Then they came for the mentally infirm, and I did not speak out--
because I was not mentally infirm;
Then they came for the Buddhists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a Buddhist;
Then they came for the gypsies, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a gypsy;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me--
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

That quote was from a German Protestant minister with a long name that
i can't remember at the moment.
----------------------------------------------------------------

Martin Niemoller.

It was written up as a poem long after his original quote, which was:

"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up
because I wasn’t a Communist;

And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up
because I wasn’t a trade unionist;

And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t
a Jew;

And then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one
left to speak up."

No homosexuals, no Jews, no Bhuddists, no gypsies, no mentally infirm.

re Jews see above for what you wrote a few minutes prior to saying "
No homosexuals, no Jews, no Bhuddists, no gypsies, no mentally
infirm." It was "
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I
wasn’t
a Jew;"



The booze might spur RC on to accuracy, perhaps.



You're projecting again RC. Have one on me. If anyone has been
hitting the
sauce...or something stronger...ahhh, why bother. Back to ignoring your
drivel. Gnork...despite our frequent disagreements...do you REALLY like
being on the same side as this turd??? Is that all it takes to get on
your
side....some phony flag waving? If so...there goes your last shred of
credibility.

I have several shreds.

mario in victoria
--
if you can't quote correctly...?

Or if you can't pay attention to your own quotes...

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Obama
    ... Unless of course you would rather avoid war at ... Don't try to speak for me Carlisle, ... Afghanistan because they were not directly threatening us; ... Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out-- ...
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  • Re: Obama
    ... Unless of course you would rather avoid war at ... Don't try to speak for me Carlisle, ... Then they came for the mentally infirm, and I did not speak out-- ... Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out-- ...
    (alt.sports.baseball.bos-redsox)
  • Re: Bad for the Jews
    ... these conservative Jews are denouncing the leftist Jews, ... they are speaking, but that they purport to speak for all Jews. ... I have never heard a single one of my favorite Jewish ... word to Wolfowitz or whoever else is considered a Jewish neocon. ...
    (soc.culture.jewish.moderated)