Re: The GIMME state

On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 23:45:12 -0500, Tony wrote:

Joe explained :
On 2009-03-03, Miss Elaine Eos <Misc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article <slrngqpi4h.if0.joe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Joe <joe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

While I am definitely in the pro-choice camp, I also find it
absolutely disgusting how far we have allowed father's rights to
deteriorate.

While I agree with the statement as stated, I would not want to see
[alleged!] fathers have anything more than an opinion to weigh-in on the
abortion decision.

I would prefer that they have at least slightly more power than that.

What "more power" could there be that doesn't either order or prevent an
abortion? Everything short of that is just weighing in with an opinion.


I think that there should be, at very least, the ability to have both
parties heard by a disinterested third party to resolve the conflict.
By giving the woman all of the rights in such a matter, the man's
rights are completely ignored. It takes two to tango, it should take
two to flush it...

If she doesn't want the child are you going to volunteer to carry him
or her for the 9 months it takes to bring him or her to term (if that
were possible)?

A man has full control over the situation. He exerts that control
*before* he sticks it in.

But situations change. What was a committed relationship on
the night in question can turn into the ex from hell a few
weeks later. Not to mention deceit: "don't worry, honey, I
had my tubes tied, you can't get me pregnant."

Beyond that, Joe wasn't necessarily referring to a refusal
of responsibility. This is not a given at the moment: a
father's first and often only duty seems to be to pay, pay,
pay. If you are the father of a child, should you not also
have the right to at least be consulted in the manner of the
birth, in the naming of the infant (I like Ottokar), in its
upbringing?


Separate issues. I believe in the right to an abortion as an option.
I do not believe that the Woman should have all of the power in a
matter that so profoundly affects the man.

Then don't bang a woman who would abort your child. Oh, that's right.
It takes some time to figure out what kind of woman she is, and you
lose a lot of gratuitous banging while you're doing that. My bad.

Even if you're married to her, you can't guarantee that she
won't surprise you with a decision to abort. If your wife
had decided not to have her child because she has a deep
horror of having disabled kids, there would be nothing you
could do...



An abortion is a difficult decision, and no matter how you cut it, it
is a decision that impacts more lives than just the mother's, either
way.

Oh, I agree with all of this. I just don't think that everyone whose
life is impacted should have anything more than a registered opinion on
whether or not to get an abortion.

---

Btw, in my younger, poorer, less-attached years, I had much the opposite
reaction as you describe a few paragraphs up. We used birth control,
but it always drove me nuts to know that a woman could conceive and bear
a child without my "permission" (correct response: "should've thought of
that before you had sex" ;) The idea of some of the women I was with
attempting to raise a child -- with or without my financial support --
was simply absurd and irresponsible in the extreme, to me.

...But that didn't stop me from letting them have their way with me ;)

But that's the difference. A woman cannot conceive without your
"permission". When you have sex, even with a condom, spermicide, the
pill and a diaphragm, you still need to be aware that accidents
happen. She CAN, on the other hand, have an abortion without your
permission, even if you are completely against it.

That's right. She can. She can also bring the child to term to hook
you through the bag financially for 18+ years (depends on the state).

Sometimes even if the child is not yours at all. I believe
that's what happened to de Niro ...


Almost would make one think twice about banging random women, wouldn't
it.

One little "swimmer" gets away, and you're out approx $100,000. Think
about that next time. :)

$100K? How do you know Joe is on minimum wage?
:-)


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: The elephant is in the room. Want to discuss it?
    ... I personally do not even feel a man should have any say-so in what a woman should do with her body as it pertains to an abortion mainly because it is the woman who carries a child. ... Whatever reason a woman has for obtaining an abortion, I am sure she went through a degree of agony to make that choice and decided to do it for a very good reason. ... My own personal opinion is that no one should question her reason for doing it because it is her body. ...
    (sci.med.transcription)
  • Re: The GIMME state
    ... fathers have anything more than an opinion to weigh-in on the abortion decision. ... Everything short of that is just weighing in with an opinion. ... By giving the woman all of the rights in such a matter, the man's rights are completely ignored. ... Then don't bang a woman who would abort your child. ...
    (alt.smokers.cigars)
  • Re: A 17-year-old can get an abortion, but not join the Marines?
    ... allowed to prevent their 17-year-old child from having an abortion. ... I think a minor should have to have parental permission for any kind ... wouldn't answer a direct question about this side of his opinion, ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)
  • Re: A 17-year-old can get an abortion, but not join the Marines?
    ... allowed to prevent their 17-year-old child from having an abortion. ... I'm sure Trent will be along any minute now to apologize for his comment about my "biased" interpretation. ... wouldn't answer a direct question about this side of his opinion, ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)
  • Re: Abortion
    ... and of course the rights of those men who want to get laid without strings or responsibility... ... If a man produces a child he IS FORCED, by courts, to pay child support. ... Abortion is providing women with a means of accepting their responsibility. ...
    (alt.politics)