Re: coffee rant

On 2008-08-30, Paul M. Cook <pmcook@xxxxxxx> wrote:

"Joe" <joe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:slrngbhhb3.44s.joe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On 2008-08-29, Paul M. Cook <pmcook@xxxxxxx> wrote:


I don't either but I damn sure am trying to learn as much as I can and
that
is more than you can say and I see nothing to apologize for.

This will get you started.

http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2008/04/19/bananas/index.html

I'll say this, no murder mystery ever read so good as the story of
bananas.

You wonder why people never accept your citations? Come on. You say
that Millions have been slaughtered by Banana companies, then provide
a link to an ultra-left website reviewing a book, and nowhere in the
review does it say anything like your claim.


I said it would get Ken started. One has to start somewehre and that piece
is as good as any.

How does it get anyone started? It doesn't support your assertions in
any way.

Millions have been slaughtered not by Banana companies
but by the people that support them such as ruthless dictators etc. Peasant
rebellion was dealt with ruthlessly and still is. When we overthrew a
democratically elected leader the bloodshed was immediate and intense.
Anyone who supported him was a target and that meant the farmers. And it
didn't stop there, either. It kept on going for decades.

Sure, but it wasn't always us. It wasn't even always our corporate
interests. South America has been very unstable for a very long time.
It is starting to get better, but there is still a way to go...

I know I know,
you are a man of facts, data, imperical evidebnce - show me the numbers.
Well the UN keeps a lot of those numbers and we know what you think of them,
right? So what is the point. 20K a year dead for 100 years? Yeah,
positively outside the realm of even possibility.

What is the point? The point is to show that the numbers exist,
rather than the obvious alternative, which would be that you made them
up...


Hell, if it were everything else that it is and at least actually
supported your claim, I'd at least find it worth reading into.

Why do you think you should be able to make wild-assed assertions,
then expect others to try to find support for them?

It's by far not the only account. Just a primer. Like it or not that is
the hisrory of that part of the world - and ours as well. You can read what
Smedly Butler had to say about it - I warn you - it ain't pretty.

I don't disagree about thhe grisly nature of the last century in South
America. I do disagree about the scope of it, and the claim that it
was all our fault...


There HAVE been some nasty problems in S America. Many have been
created by these (and other) produce companies. But I can't find
anything that even comes close to the numbers you are throwing out
there. Either that means that I am just missing some important
websites, or it means that you are (again) inflating your numbers
(usually by a factor of 5x-10x) to try to make your point.

Like I said, we don't do body counts. Other organizations do and they place
the number in the millions. It's been going on since Woodrow Wilson was
president.

Great! All anyone asked was that you provide a link to those numbers.
None of us seem to be able to find them.


Sadly, all it does is ruin any modicum of credibility you may have
once had.

I can deal with that. And like that is the first time you've said that.
LOL! As if this isn't the first time you ever even heard of UFCO.

LOL. No, not the first time I have heard of UFCO. I've read more
about them today than I ever have before though, trying to find some
support of your claims...

And the fact is, you are right. It has been a long time since you
really had any credibility. To be fair, though, it is your own fault.
You constantly inflate the numbers trying to make a big case for
problems that aren't nearly that big. 200,000 is bad enough. You
don't need to make it 2 Million to make the case. And if it IS 2
million, just show it. I'm more than willing to buy into it. I just
ask for the proof...

--
Joe - Linux User #449481/Ubuntu User #19733
joe at hits - buffalo dot com
"Hate is baggage, life is too short to go around pissed off all the
time..." - Danny, American History X
.

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