Re: Privacy.LIE - their REAL privacy policy!

In article <1131616646.543349.300100@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
netsurf1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx says...
> Your "admitting" to a set of circumstances that would not apply to 95%
> of the people that use the internet. It would invlove millions of
> dollars worth of equipment and a serious matter to warrant the very
> costly expense of traffic analysis on the scale you describe. In
> answer to your comment about being pro-open, I don't have any problem
> with that. What I do have a problem with is deception. The kind of
> deception that trolls in newsgroups and makes people believe that they
> are easily prone to be the subject of logging/traffic analysis by
> different organizations when in fact that's not true for 95% of net
> users.

It is true for users of a particular server, it is trivial to monitor
traffic in and out of one machine.

>
> For 95% of net users, a good privacy provider that dosen't log the way
> that you do is more than enough privacy protection, they are the ones
> that don't worry about having millions spent in traffic analysis on
> them.

Logging does not matter at all when talking traffic analysis. One does
not need to know what that box is doing at all, just how long it took a
packet to pass through it. Again, real time stream means the time it
takes a packet to pass through the machine will be constant. To change
that you need to do random latency and reordering. Both play havoc on a
real time traffic stream.

>
> Your remarks do tend to make the reader get used to the fact that logs
> are a fact of life if they use certain services like yours, even if you
> say that your encrypted connections are not logged, your "maintenance"
> logging with analysis, by you yourself, can lead to a detailed account
> of who did what - period.

You seem to think that what I do is some kind of huge secret. I am dead
honest with our users. I tell them what isn't logged, what is, and
exactly why. What other services don't log is exactly what we don't
log.

> So, if you want to be "the only one to admit" to possibilities, don't
> deceive readers that thier all doomed to be logged in one form or
> another, and that nothing can be done about it. This is what YOU have
> a problem with. Just like a previous post said, it's not only your
> way, and a handful of other privacy companies are doing a great job for
> the 95% of users that don't fall within your Cotse guidlines of traffic
> analysis, which could run into the hundreds of thousands of dollars, if
> not in the millions of dollars. You may think your important for this
> kind of attention, but your not.

It doesn't take millions of dollars to run traffic analysis on one
machine. It takes about $100 and access to the gateway or switch. I
still don't get your desire to turn this into a Cotse/Someone else
fight. It is a discussion on what is possible and what users have to be
aware is possible. Do you keep trying to cloud this in a some kind of
service war because you can't argue the facts?

/steve
--
The Missing Amendment
The Right To Privacy
http://www.themissingamendment.org
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Privacy.LIE - their REAL privacy policy!
    ... costly expense of traffic analysis on the scale you describe. ... For 95% of net users, a good privacy provider that dosen't log the way ... deceive readers that thier all doomed to be logged in one form or ...
    (alt.privacy)
  • Re: www.cotse.net
    ... Five other privacy outfits don't do anything at all different than Cotse. ... Steve has actual control of his equipment and they don't, ... >>>setup is a far cry from any existing privacy service, ... >>>It is a paper on low cost traffic analysis of the Tor network. ...
    (alt.privacy)
  • Re: Privacy.LIE - their REAL privacy policy!
    ... > It may cost $100 to do the kind of traffic analysis you do, ... The only one bringing up "service war" with ... > "someone" is you, I have no finacial interest in ANY privacy company, ...
    (alt.privacy)
  • Re: www.cotse.net
    ... > being your inspiration for a privacy service and that you started cotse ... claiming that even Tor is succeptable to traffic analysis. ... real time traffic stream that isn't even mixed. ...
    (alt.privacy)