Re: never thought I'd see this

John wrote:
"J. Carroll" wrote:

John Scheldroup wrote:
"John" <amdinc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:460B429E.D8BF6376@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
John Scheldroup wrote:

"John" <amdinc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:460B36C7.B404A233@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
kurgan wrote:

On Mar 27, 6:41 pm, Kirk Gordon <k...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
J. Carroll wrote:

This is worth a read Kirk.

AFTER THE EXECUTION
So, Saddam Is Dead . . .
But the way of the world remains Saddam's.

BY MARK BOWDEN

<snip>

Definitely worth a read. And I agree with nearly every
word - except that I can't tell whether Bowden thinks the US
should stay in Iraq, or leave.

He writes that "no one who cares about the idea of Iraq is
rooting for the U.S. to depart any time soon". The "idea of
Iraq", I take to be an Iraqi version of people with "reasons
for considering themselves part of something bigger" than
themselves or their current conflicts. That sounds like we
need to stay, and to help the Iraqi people define and embrace
their nation as something bigger and more important than their
factional differences and hatreds.

<snip>

That sounds good in theory, but in practice how does having US
troops in Iraq facilitate that? Only a small fraction of our
troops are able to speak the language.

They have to do it for themselves and it's not gonna happen
until a mind boggling amount of blood is spilled. The longer we
stay there, the more the pressure meter in the cooker goes up.
Our presence is merely preventing them from doing to each other
what they really want to do and the longer all out war is
supressed, the higher the amplitude of the all out war when we
do eventually leave.

We should move out a city at a time. Tell em up front we are
moving out and it will up to them to maintain the peace. If
things get bad send in more Eraqis. Now theres a plan... lets
do something.


Patton had said; We should use the Germans to invade then
conquer the Russians into submission;.. before we start a war...

John

Patton was on the edge, but he know how to run his tanks.


Thank god for Marshall.


Marshall Plan ? If they not gotten it they still would be right
where the are today,

Perhaps but we certainly wouldn't. United States forieng policy in
Europe after WWII did at least as much to secure Americas place in
the world as our Army's did during it. You couldn't, of cousre, have
had the former without the latter but the world would be a different
place today had we not pitched in with the Marshal Plan.


I remember the 50's Americans were held in high esteem most all over
the world. It took a continuing slide when we started to but into the
national affairs of foreign countrys.

The best way to win over a foreign country is economically. Observe
what is happening with China and the US.

Works good for wild animals too, feed em.

The difficulty, obviously, is that it's an approach that requires both
patience and maturity.

All of the crap, and it is exactly crap, that you hear about the world
rubbing our nose in *** and not getting as response isn't true. The
response just didn't originate in the locker room and the "heads" making the
decisions took a longer view than trying to one up daddy lends itself too.
The US is the 800 pound gorilla in the room and we can just squat on people
to have our way if we want to. Reagan pulled us out of Beirut because he
basically decided we didn't need their ***. He didn't surrender a thing -
he totally screwed the locals, however, and that was his purpose. I'm not a
big Reagan fan but the guy really was a man, not a small fearful child, and
I can only wonder what he would have thought of our current leaders.

One of our real strengths is that we have the ability to respond any friggin
way we want. We ARE the biggest dog on the block. Our weakness seems to lie
in having the wisdom to consider interests before emotion. In other words,
politics wins out over common sense or long term interests every time.
When you control the pace of things you control whatever the "thing" is
completely. Running off half cocked when you don't need to surrenders the
advantage. It's immature, foolish, wasteful, and stupid. There are also
unintended consequences and those don't just dissapear. You can't make thing
right by saying "Sorry, I didn't know". Try unringing a bell some time.
If you figure out how let me know, I've a couple I'd like to unring.

--

John R. Carroll
Machining Solution Software, Inc.
Los Angeles San Francisco
www.machiningsolution.com


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