Re: 2x10 versus 2x12
- From: Jim <jim@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 08:15:25 -0700
bluesman56 <NOSPAMtom.press@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"Squier" <squier@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message news:010920082252111596%squier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxCould the 2x10s be out of phase with your amp? I had this happen with my 2x10. When kicked on, the volume actually dropped. After checking and correcting...The difference was night and day.RichL <rpleavitt@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:well the 2x10 is loaded with Celestion G10 Greenbacks which are 97 db @ 1 watt
Squier <squier@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Do you know how the speaker efficiencies compare?
and the 2x12 is loaded with Eminence Texas Heat which are 99-100 db @ 1 watt.
Here's the thing though - the Texas Heats seem to sound great at any volume.
They (of course) add in their own color to the sound but it pretty much
stays consistent. Eminence states that they need at least 5 watts to get
to specs and after that they take up to 150 watts. The Mark III can play
soft or loud with these and once I set the tone I can just up the Master
and it stays very consistent. I don't have to deal with speaker break up
as another variable to deal with as the volume/power increases.
However - it seems the G10 Greenbacks have a sweet spot in volume and
anything less and they sound like shrill crap with a slightly grinding
bottom end. Play them too loud and it's all breakup - but they get a little
too loud for some places and some songs really don't do well with the
greenback breakup (although if you step back the sound really swirls around
and sounds good about 20 feet away or more). But there is no 'in between'
when I back off the volume all that nice grind and breakup comes to a halt
and what's left is a somewhat shrill wimpy washed out sound. (at least in
the mix it can suddenly sit way too far down and it's like I'm playing but
there's no apparent sound coming out well ok - you know what I mean).
So the thing is that unless I can stay at that sweet spot all the time
then the Greenbacks just don't cut it. Maybe good for original artists
or for playing rock that wants those tones and at that volume/sweet spot
but for covers and then backing down for the slow dance tunes and for some
funk and R&B then they leave he sweet spot and it's a washout.
The nice part is that because they are not all that efficient you also
get to crank up the amp's power section a bit more which is cool.
But ah well - they just offer a very narrow sweet spot and the tones
are constantly changing throughout the set list as the volume changes
through the song set(s). When we practice in the basement we actually
tend to play a bit louder than we actually do playing out and so I never
realized completely how important (or how narrow) that sweet spot is
with these speakers.
The Texas Heats let me keep the same tone(s) throughout the volume range
of what we play. And even when I back off the guitar volume to sit back
I still get that consistent slight grit but sweet sounds from that 2x12.
It's not that the 2x10 is a bad cab - it's just that the sweet spot
is way too narrow for it to sound good in a wide mix of songs or
range of venues where the sweet spot might be too loud or not enough.
(when I REALLY crank it and unleash the wattage into it then the G10 Greenies
start to really breakup and just fall apart - some might like it but the
breakup at that point is way too severe sounding for my ears and my bandmates)
Well I might agree with you if it was another rig or setup.
But it's a Mesa/Boogie Mark III head with a 2x10. So that's
a good thought but not really applicable for the head and 2x10 cab I'm using.
If it was a combo where each speaker goes to a different speaker out
on the back panel then this might have been the problem.
Ah well - thanks for the comments though.
Well... The speakers could be wired out of phase with each other, because you have two. Put a 9V battery on the end of the speaker cable (on and off, don't hold it, that'll just drain the battery) to verify that the cones move in the same direction.