Re: Volume

It's like you just don't WANT to get what I'm saying.

To sum it up: The various volume controls in any signal chain are NOT
created equal,

The FIRST block, the one that generates the signal (in this case a bass)
needs to be as strong as possible in order to overcome the various
degradations the signal encounters on it's way to the speaker. The WEAKER
this initial signal is, the WORSE the over all signal will be.

To address your key point as succinctly as I can: If you are worried about
clipping, the solution is in the amp's gain control, NOT the bass! Again,
"10" on a bass is "0" or Unity Gain. If you unhooked the PUs from the volume
and went directly to the jack, the signal would be the same ( a little
better actually, but that's another thread).

Any modern bass amp is built to accept this "unity" input, be it passive or
active. Most amps of any era can take a passive input no problem.

If you encounter signal distortion or clipping, barring malfunctions, it's
usually 1 of 2 things - 1) the pre gain is set too high 2) some element of
you EQ setup is set too high, or you have doubled settings from the active
EQ on your bass. This is the most common reason for clipping I've found.

Again, here's the key point - if you adjust your BASS to clipping, this you
wind up amplifying mush more NOISE, not to mention the loss of tone,
particularly in passive systems.

If you only have one volume control, turning down you bass is even less
useful because it becomes a "6 of one, 1/2 dozen of the other" war. You'll
REALLY notice the added noise in this scheme.

If you're really, honestly having a clip problem (or can't get as loud as
YOU want to be) no matter how much you lower the amp gain, then you need to
either use the "active" padded input (yes it feeds less signal, but it's
much cleaner IMO than rolling off a pot since the "unity" signal has already
left your bass), or the amp is simply too underpowered for your needs.

Please, just TRY running your bass full out and adjusting the gain on your a
mp - just for ONE gig. I can virtually guarantee you won't need to worry
about hoarding "reserve" volume again.

"pTooner" <geddings@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:uzV7l.2152$vs6.747@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Since this is an interesting and apparently often misunderstood subject,
let me try to be clear and detailed. Coming out of the jack on your
bass is a constant level of noise. If you decrease the level of signal
by lowering the volume control then you decrease the signal to noise
ratio. Technically that is an absolutely true statement. It is also
true if you are measuring at the amp end of the cable since a fair
amount of noise is induced into the cable. HOWEVER, in modern equipment
that noise level is extremely low. Also, many players like me use a
wireless link which removes the tendency of noise to be induced into the
cable.
Now as to the amplifier or preamp section of the preamp - it is correct
that it produces the best quality sound (read most linear amplification)
near it's maximum level. However, and this is a big one, if you
overdrive a solid state amp even a little bit ugly things happen.
Therefore, most folks will set their input gain at such a level that it
will NEVER clip! If you set the level a little lower than optimal
nothing really bad happens, but if you set it a little higher than
optimal it makes ugly noises at best. Now the final gain stage is
controlled by the main volume and it has a much wider normal operating
range. However, if you go too high ugly (expensive) things can occur.
Depending on the exact setup you may fry your cabs or you may fry your
output. Prior to the smoke leaking out (everything runs on smoke, when
it leaks out they quit working) you should hear some ugly sounds but not
always.

Different players sometimes set up systems in ways that I would think
wouldn't work at all but I guess it works for them. If you understand
the above explanation you will have a good grounding to work from to
establish what you want and it should help you understand what is
happening.

This isn't addressed to anyone in particular so I didn't quote anything
it's just a general explanation.

Gerry

(I am an EE)


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Nasty Noise from Amp
    ... I was facing the amp when the noise occurred. ... The head's connected to the speakers with a couple of short Monster speaker cables. ... Play bass through practice amp to see if problem occurs there. ...
    (alt.guitar.bass)
  • Re: The Last Word
    ... practical optimum point (no audible noise), ... turning the bass volume down further ... full-on in order to achieve tone variations. ... control or the other, there's not a lot more to gain beyond that. ...
    (alt.guitar.bass)
  • Re: Nasty Noise from Amp
    ... and I was using the wireless. ... I was facing the amp when the noise occurred. ... I replaced the jack in the bass. ...
    (alt.guitar.bass)
  • Re: The Last Word
    ... What I said was that you can maximize your signal-to-noise ratio by ... so that the difference between the noise floor ... Think about that for a second, your bass ... going to be attenuated exactly the same as any signal by the volume control. ...
    (alt.guitar.bass)
  • The Last Word
    ... Opinion doesn't change the signal to noise ratio. ... ANY of that, just TRY playing your bass on 10, properly gain stage your amp, ...
    (alt.guitar.bass)