OT, I guess - Interview with Rob Burnett & Jon Beckerman

From the FutonCritic.com:
http://www.thefutoncritic.com/rant.aspx?id=20070307_knights


03.07.07 - 06:26 PM]
ON THE FUTON WITH... ROB BURNETT AND JON BECKERMAN
By Brian Ford Sullivan

Welcome once again to "On the Futon With...," a new (hopefully) weekly
feature where I sit down and talk TV with some of my favorite people
in the industry, all the while trying to give the impression I'm not
some overgrown fanboy.

THIS WEEK'S GUEST: "The Knights of Prosperity" co-creators Rob Burnett
and Jon Beckerman.

Rob Burnett and Jon Beckerman know all about the weird, crazy road
shows sometimes can take on their way to the air. "Ed" began as a
single-camera half-hour for CBS before finally airing as an hour
dramedy on NBC. ABC's "The Knights of Prosperity" began as "Let's Rob
Mick Jagger" and before that Jeff Goldblum. It's a road they
nevertheless embrace as the end result in both cases have been shows
they're extremely proud of. I recently had the chance to chat with Rob
and Jon, where we talked about said weird, crazy roads, the struggles
most new comedies go through and of course, "Ed's" DVD chances.

[EDITOR'S NOTE: This interview took place last month, before ABC
announced it was benching the series for the time being. In a follow
up e-mail Jon told me: "As you may have seen, the last episode that
aired introduced a new storyline about the Knights robbing Ray Romano.
The four remaining unaired episodes start, but do not finish, that
storyline. The reason ABC pulled the last four episodes was so that
the show could potentially be relaunched in the fall at the beginning
of the Ray story, rather than somewhere in the middle of things."]

Brian Ford Sullivan: Before we start - I have to ask, who do I have to
kidnap, blackmail and/or threaten to get "Ed" on DVD?

Rob Burnett: We're working on that. [Laughs.]

Jon Beckerman: Yeah, it's been sort of confusing especially since
everything else that's ever been made for television seems to be on
DVD now. But our understanding is that things got kind of tied up in
between the different entities that were involved in producing the
show. Because it was a joint production of Viacom Productions, which
no longer exists, and NBC Productions and I guess Viacom kind of got
absorbed back into Paramount and I don't know, it's just a whole maze
of executives and confusion. But we've had a lot of requests for it
come our way and so we just want copies for ourselves mostly.
[Laughs.] We'd like that to happen.

RB: I think that the real reason is that the show is so good they fear
that if they put it on DVD people would die of laughter. So it's
really a precautionary measure.

BFS: [To channel Rob Thomas, who's going through similar troubles with
"Cupid"] does it drive you crazy to see something like "She Spies"
make it to DVD before "Ed?"

RB: Don't sell "She Spies" short. [Laughs.]

JB: Was that the show with Natasha Henstridge? I always thought it was
very interesting that she was in a movie called "Species," which some
people pronounce "Spe-Shes," and then she was in a show called "She
Spies." Is that a coincidence or is that why they called it "She
Spies?"

BFS: I think you're on to something.

JB: I throw that out to your readership. [Laughs.]

BFS: Alright, onto "Knights." To start, why Mick Jagger?

JB: Well, as you may know the show started out with a pitch that Rob
and I brought to all four networks - not including the CW - with Donal
Logue and the pitch was for a show called "Let's Rob Jeff Goldblum."
And we pitched that without mentioning it to Jeff. [Laughs.] We just
thought it was sort of a funny name. [It] had kind of an odd, random
quality to it. Also that Jeff would actually be funny doing it. And we
sold that version to all of the networks we pitched it to, which was
pretty crazy. And basically what happened was we ended up talking to
Jeff about it but he was already almost committed to the show
"Raines," and I think it's coming on pretty soon on NBC. And so then
it became a matter of making all kinds of lists and looking for other
people. And [ABC Entertainment president] Steve McPherson floated the
idea of Mick and we kind of just laughed it off as [it] seemed like an
impossibility. But we went ahead and rewrote a version of the script
to incorporate Mick and wrote his little E! channel stuff. That was
pretty much how the idea came up. Lists were made of the biggest stars
in the world and many of them we knew were absolutely impossible to
ever appear in even the tiniest cameo and Mick we thought was equally
impossible. He ended up reading our script on a flight to Japan or
something and really thinking it was funny. And the rest kind of fell
into place from there. But we shot several days on the pilot before we
had any kind of commitment from Mick. And his material was not shot
until several weeks later in New Zealand. So all of that kind of
happened at the very last minute.

BFS: And then the idea itself, where did that come from?

RB: You know, we've always been attracted to kind of the idea of doing
a show about an everyman and we also liked the idea of doing a show
that had a funny idea behind it. As opposed to, you know a lot of
comedies today though they might be funny don't necessarily have a
comic premise to them. We thought it would be interesting to try and
do a show that just when you said it, it sounded funny. You know,
unlike a bunch of people sitting around in an office or a bar or this
or that. So we had originally talked about maybe doing a show about
people, a bunch of average guys, who are not at all equipped with any
kind of expertise trying to rob a bank. And we developed that for a
little bit and we were getting close to going out to California in
order to pitch that and at the time we found out unbeknownst to us -
we tend to work in a vacuum a little bit in New York - that there was
this show "Heist" that had just been purchased by NBC. Then we felt
kind of silly going out to pitch a show about guys trying to rob a
bank after now "Heist" was the thing that was happening. And even
though the shows were pretty different, I think it was a drama and
ours was a comedy, we went back to the drawing board and started
thinking more about it. And we thought, you know what, there might be
a better idea here. What if the thing that they were robbing was funny
and instead of it being a bank what if it was Jeff Goldblum for
example and it just made us laugh so we figured let's give that a
shot.

BFS: Having done both "Letterman" and now scripted shows like "Ed" and
"Knights," what the was catalyst behind making that transition?

JB: I think it was not a matter of preferring one to the other so much
as just wanting to try new things. Both of us obviously spent many
years doing variety and I think probably felt like we had thought of
the best stuff we were likely to think of in that format. I had also
worked for and with the guy who's best at doing that, namely Dave. So
it wasn't as though, you know, when we thought about doing another
project that we were just going to just leap into another talk show
for another guy. Because at that point, why not just, you know,
continue with "Letterman" stuff which would be fine too. It was mostly
just a matter of okay, let's see what else is out there to try. "Ed"
was originally pitched as a half-hour, single-camera show so that's
something that we had kind of being trying to do for a long time. And
when CBS didn't want a single-camera half-hour, we turned it into a
single-camera hour which ended up on NBC. That was sort of the weird
path to the "Ed" that landed on television. But in the meantime,
obviously single-camera half-hours got a lot more popular, or at least
a little more popular, so we finally had the chance to develop this
one.

BFS: Speaking of single-camera shows, are there any that you watch
regularly?

RB: The original "Office." When I saw that, the British version of
"The Office," I pretty much felt like it was time to leave television
and open up a deli. [Laughs.] Because I just thought that was about as
good as you can do. And then surprisingly, much to my shock, I thought
that the American "Office" managed to and continues to manage to be
very, very strong. When I heard that Greg Daniels was taking on that,
I just thought that felt like somebody putting on Babe Ruth's uniform
to take batting practice. [Laughs.] This poor man is going to get his
head handed to him. But they managed to pull that off. I tend to watch
that. I also watch "Extras," I pretty much will watch anything that
Ricky Gervais and Stephen Merchant will do. I'm also a fan of
"Entourage" definitely. What other HBO ones... "Curb Your Enthusiasm"
for sure. So yeah, I feel like there's a lot more good half-hours than
there used to be. I was a huge "Larry Sanders" fan but at that time it
seemed like that was pretty much the only thing of its type. And now
there's several.

BFS: Whereas traditional sitcoms seem to be disappearing...

RB: Yeah, it's crazy how that's happened and yet, when you look at
what's actually getting the best ratings in the world of comedy it
continues to be the traditional half-hour. It's weird. As great as
"The Office" is and as successful as it's been, you know getting Emmys
and stuff, and as big as "Earl" is, if you really look at their
ratings compared to like "Two and a Half Men" and ["Rules of
Engagement"], it's like a whole cut above. And so this whole single-
camera/multi-camera thing is kind of confusing. [Laughs.] I don't
know, I don't know. Also I like "How I Met Your Mother" by the way.
That's like the only kind of multi-camera looking half-hour that's
come along lately that I've been [addicted to].

BFS: So moving forward on "Knights," where do you see the show going?
Will the Mick Jagger thing always be the carrot on the stick?

JB: Well, where we left off at the end of [episode] seven was
basically the guys losing all of the progress I've made in the season
so far. And the next two episodes, the one that airs this Wednesday,
which I would recommend to people who haven't watched the show, if
you're going to watch one, this might be the one to watch for better
or for worse. It's one of my favorites that we've done. But this and
the next one kind of start a new storyline that - without giving too
much away - introduces more than one major celebrity [to rob]. We're
kind of doing a little transition and getting a new story arc going
over the next couple of weeks.

BFS: Is that a direct result of not being able to use Mick on a
regular basis?

JB: Well, you know, as it turns out as exciting as it was to get one
of the world's biggest all-time rock stars in our pilot, as you may
have noticed he didn't pop up a lot in succeeding episodes. [Laughs.]
And we felt like rather than kind of biding our time until that day
would come when Mick would be available, that there were other
directions we could move things. So that's what you'll start to be
seeing over the next couple of weeks.

BFS: So as far as the characters go, it feels like the actors quickly
"became" their roles. Like I don't think I could picture anyone
besides Kevin Michael Richardson playing Rockefeller Butts at this
point. Did that surprise you?

RB: I feel like we got very lucky with the casting. And most people
that do this for a living will tell you that shows pretty much live or
die by casting. I mean without a doubt, it's the most important
element of any show. Jon and I would go out to California for these
trips and more often than not, we'd come back and we just were gitty
we were so happy with the people that we were getting. And I think one
of the strengths of the cast for us is that unlike the structure of
other shows, we were not necessarily locked in to the characters that
we had. We had ideas for characters and if we couldn't cast them or
couldn't figure them out in the writing we would just, we would cut
them. So it was really, the idea was let's go out and get really funny
people and then write for those funny people. And luckily we've got
really, really funny people in the cast. Obviously it stars with Donal
so right there the bar is very high and then when we started adding
everybody else we just felt incredibly lucky. It's great to be writing
a show where you kind of feel like you can just toss the ball to
anybody and they're going to nail it. It's been a thrill for us. It's
the second show we've done that we've been very lucky with casting.

BFS: So I generally try to ask everyone - if you had 30-seconds to
tell people why they should watch your show, what would you say?

JB: There would be a lot of begging involved. We'd put "please" a lot
in there. [Laughs.] For starters I'd say that I don't think there's
another comedy on the air quite like it. Um... God... I'm wasting my
30 seconds here. [Laughs.] It's like a buzzer is going to go off and
I've completely failed this task. I don't know, it's hard to say
anything without it sounding like begging.

RB: What's frustrating - I'll jump in for a second - I think that one
thing that's been a strange experience with this particular endeavor
for us is that the response of the people that watch the show has been
very, very positive. And I think the network itself has done focus
groups on people that are watching the show and people really, really
like it. I think the show is a little bit of a departure for what ABC
is used to putting on the air in the past. They're used to having
pretty much very traditional multi-camera sitcoms. I think now we find
ourselves in a place where you know we're just struggling for people
to sample the show. Because when they sample it, they seem to really
like it. But the comedy is, like Jon said, different than a lot of
other things on television. We like to think that it's smart and
sophisticated without being self-aggrandizing. I mean Jon and I have
spent most of our adult lives kind of analyzing and honing comedy. And
not that we're necessarily amazing at it but we have a very strong
opinion and sensibility about what we think it should be but at the
same time we feel like the show is very accessible in its comedy. You
know I can tell you I get ridiculous amounts of compliments from the
11 and 12-year-old boys that are watching the show. [Laughs.] So it's
nothing that's necessarily hard or difficult to figure out and yet at
the same time there's a couple levels to it that I think different
people enjoy. I think I've gone over 30 seconds. [Laughs.] You didn't
stop me so I kept on going.

BFS: So I've always wanted to ask this - what's your routine on
Thursday when the ratings come out? Are you up bright and early next
to the fax machine?

RB: I'm up early on Thursday mornings to check the ratings on "Friday
Night Lights," which is my favorite show in television. I want to make
sure that they stay on the air. That is almost more important to me at
this point because of my viewing patterns. [Laughs.]

JB: And I'm up at 5 a.m. in the morning because that's when my 19-
month-old daughter gets up.

RB: Yes, his 19-month-old daughter is checking the ratings. [Laughs.]

JB: She wants to know if she'll be going to college. [Laughs.] The
truth is - and I know this is the pat answer - we do this because this
is what we love to do but our ability to do this depends upon people
watching it. And everyone would love to have a hit show. You know, at
this point we'd be perfectly happy with a niche audience that shows up
and can keep the show on the air. [Laughs.] As Rob was saying, for
whatever reason - whether it be we premiered on January 3 right after
the holidays, whether it be that our show has a bizarre title that
doesn't apply to any type of television show that the average person
would like to watch, whether it be that we were quickly overwhelmed by
the tsunami that is "American Idol," whether it be we're currently on
between "George Lopez" and "According to Jim," neither of which are
particularly similar in tone or sensibility to our show, who knows -
the fact is that we haven't had a huge sampling yet from the audience
at all. It wasn't one of those things where you premiere big because
of the hype and then the next week you're down 40% or something. It
was simply that people had not seen the show. And we don't know why
honestly. It could be any or the reasons I listed or it could be
completely other kind of reasons. But you know the network has really
tried to get behind it. They think that they have something that it
could grow if more people saw it. It could become something. All we
can do is keep at it, try to do good shows and happily I can say,
creatively, as happy as we have been with the ones that have aired, I
think the ones to come are actually better. We'd like more people to
see this show. I'm proud of it.

Maybe...maybe they can put the rest of the episodes on the same DVD
with Ed.

.