Re: Harry and Occlumency


"richard e white" <chiphead@xxxxxxx> wrote in message news:46605AE2.3EE225C5@xxxxxxxxxx
Joe Bednorz wrote:

On Sat, 26 May 2007 17:20:00 GMT, Clell Harmon wrote in
<4%Z5i.134027$_c5.125355@attbi_s22>:


Compared to that sending the trained MoM hit wizards back in time to
capture Voldemort at the end of OotP is a piece of cake.

With out the time turners? they where all broken. How far can they go
back and how long do they take to make?


Exactly - JKR saw that loophole and made a stab at closing it.


But there are other game-breakers in the series. Veritaserum solves
the whole problem of "Who's a Death Eater?"

Didn't you catch the bit of why DD couldn't use that potion to get the
information from slughorn?
JKR seams to be useing the idea that nearly all magic has a counter.


Indeed -the problem is, with magic, you could do anything so it would be chaos without rules. Therefore limiting factors have to be introduced, and the "counter spell" bit is one of those, as is the "you have to mean it" bit too.


A single session with Snape drinking Veritaserum easily explains why
Dumbledore trusts him.

Polyjuice potion and the Imperius Curse mean you can't trust anyone,
unless you use Veritaserum properly.

Not even then. as that potion has ways around it. The sneaker scope was
better at telling you something was wrong. It worked the problem is that
no one payed attention to what it was warning. do any of you think they
will ever realize this?


Yup, same thing again - a counter.


Portkeys allow easy travel to and from the Hogwarts grounds.

Maybe. There may be a spell thatlets some out or in but not others. If a
port key works at all times then there was no real reason for V to wait
through so much of Harry's 4th year. Some one put forth that a portkey
blocker may normaly be up but was dropped for the parents ffrom the other
school champieans to come. This would have given V only the one day for
the trap and make the rest of the book to make sence. Other wise the fake
mad eye should have just sent potter off when ever everything was ready.
But for some reason V waited ten mounths. I think the reason for this wait
may play a part in the last book. witch would be why it wasn't mentioned.
either that or a line or two from V in the grave yard was accadently cut
dureing rewrites.
I hope the former. For if it isn't mentioned it makes a whopping great
hole.


Yes, it struck me as very odd that they waited all year to get Harry to touch the portkey to take him to the graveyard. Surely they could have left something around for him to pick up and use that? To me that's always been a whopping great hole in GOF that spoilt the whole book for me: waiting a whole year and entering Harry into the competition then making him win was just too huge and improbable a construct - I couldn't suspend my disbelief anywhere near that far! Your suggestion of lowering the anti-portkey spells is a good one - that might explain why they had to wait till the end of the GOF tournament, thanks :)


The luck serum can make anyone into Superman. It's so good it's
banned at sporting competitions.

And is poisens in larg amounts or taken to often. Slughorn used it decades
apart and only twice. care to bet there is a reason for that?



The Harry Potter saga isn't a story so much as a series of
tastefully arranged plot holes.

All stories are. even in real life would of happend diffrently if little
things were known or avalable at the right time. A story is just a set of
linked events that are told. Each stry changes a bit with the retelling
even if all the people telling it are trying to tell the same story. What
happens and what could of happend aren't always the same thing.


The whole point of a good book is that it's credible within its own stated rules, boundaries, and context, so whilst there might be alternative ways of characters doing things, but there shouldn't be plotholes where the rules have been broken. Most of JKR's fulfill that for me with lots of counters to the obvious "easy" ways of doing things with magic, which is why I generally like them!

DaveD

.

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