Re: Install PCI-E, blackscreen POST
- From: Paul <nospam@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 13:35:51 -0400
Mike Easter wrote:
Paul wrote:
Thanks for your reply.
Mike Easter wrote:
I have no alternate/spare PCI-E cards (or PCI for that matter) to test
with. I am afraid to configure the bios setup to look for the video on
the PCI-E card first because if I do that and the card is bad, I will
get a blackscreen on the bios post and I won't be able to change back
to the integrated video because I won't be able to see anything to get
into the setup and make the change.
How is this business about changing from integrated video to pci-e card
supposed to be done with a BIOS which has such a configuration to
choose between integrated, pci-e or pci?
In theory, if you change a BIOS setting, and "lose control" of the
system, then using the "clear CMOS" jumper, reestablishes BIOS
defaults.
But I don't know whether the bios defaults are for using the integrated
video or a video card. The existing bios configuration was done by
hp/compaq and suits the way the box was sold, with integrated video and no
card, and while it might be 'logical' for the bios default to be
integrated, the bios itself was designed to be used with lots of different
mobos, not just the one I have.
It
pays to record any custom settings in the BIOS before going any
further - then you can put the settings back, if a "clear CMOS" is
required.
I'm not 100% sure that clear cmos would provide me with a configuration
for a 'rescue' condition, which in this case is to use the integrated
video, which works. If the default of a cleared cmos is pci or pci-e,
then I'm screwed.
When "clearing CMOS", always unplug the computer! There arehttp://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?docname=c00757470&cc=us
motherboards, where a certain diode on the motherboard is burned, if
you use the CMOS jumper, while the system is plugged in. One guy
managed to fix his
dual diode, after it got burned, but many people don't have the
skills to find and fix it, if it gets damaged. If there are text
instructions available, they will usually mention unplugging the
computer, as the first step.
You can also try plugging the monitor, into either the onboard or
the new video card, to see whether either device got enabled.
"Clearing CMOS" is mentioned at the bottom of this page.
&dlc=en&lc=en&jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN
Nice link. I was aware of that hp section, but I don't think I had
actually looked at the clear cmos pix which are crystal clear.
I'd start by plugging in the video card, and see whether you
get video on it or not. Be prepared to press the key to enter
the BIOS, to prevent the computer from booting immediately.
I've installed the video card and attached the vga cable to it and that is
the condition which gives me blackscreen POST, but I could have previously
changed the bios setting to primarily use the pci-e card, which I did not
do because I was 'afraid' -- which I still am because I'm not confident
that clear cmos will rescue me.
In the condition of pci-e card physically installed but vga cable attached
to the integrated video vga, the XP OS can recognize the card and the
accompanying evga driver software can install evga drivers for the card,
but that doesn't allay my apprehension about this bios blackout business.
If the bios doesn't know how to find a video all by itself, and expects
the setup to configure/aim it, then there must be 2 essential ingredients
to get to the OS and its drivers: the bios must know which video to use,
and there must be a working video capability there. If I change the bios
information about which video to use and there isn't a working video
there, then I'm shut out.
If the rescue operation for being shutout by restoring cmos results in a
restored cmos which is expecting a video card at pci-e or pci, then I'm
still shut out.
Motherboards can have a number of options, for BIOS behavior.
Some recent motherboards, allow onboard and video card to work
at the same time. Many will disable the onboard, when a video
card is detected as being plugged in.
That does not appear to be the case here.
You can see here, that a number of people have had trouble with theirhttp://vip.asus.com/forum/view.aspx?id=20070129192529222&board_id=1&model=
Asus retail motherboard. One guy reports one time in ten, video
appears on the PCI Express card. (In the ECS group, one user
noticed that on his system, this was caused by the PCI Express
clock being overclocked. That probably isn't the same reason here.)
M2NPV-MX&page=1&SLanguage=en-us
I'm currently conversing about this issue on the asus mobo forum section,
but so far no replies.
Thanks for your input. Maybe you can advise if there is a way to
determine what the bios defaults are without resetting to the defaults.
--
Mike Easter
If you unplug the PCI Express card, do a "Clear CMOS", you're back to
factory conditions. The motherboard should be using onboard graphics
at that point.
If the motherboard supports automatic detection of PCI Express cards,
and a PCI Express video card is present, then after clear CMOS, it
would start using the PCI Express card instead. In most cases.
The video card has a BIOS chip on it. A typical video BIOS occupies
about 64KB of lower memory. That is how the motherboard BIOS,
discovers the VESA modes the video card and monitor support.
And then it can talk to the card. For the onboard video, presumably
the video BIOS for the built-in GPU, is part of the main BIOS file
stored in the motherboard flash chip.
Default conditions for a retail motherboard, are recorded in the
motherboard manual. Default conditions are designed, such that
you should be able to get into the BIOS. The defaults would
include "Auto" for memory (read the SPD on the DIMM, set up the
memory), and "Auto" for the processor (encoded by BSEL pins, and
the rest of any settings determined by the processor enumeration
algorithm and special purpose registers inside the processor).
Generally, where user intervention is required, is in things
like boot order. The BIOS may not have a useful set of conditions
for that, and use your best judgment to set it up. (I.e. If the
computer has a boot drive and a data hard drive, ensure the boot drive
is the one selected.)
On one of my computers, I like to leave the Firewire chip and
a Promise controller disabled. So any time I clear the CMOS,
I go into the BIOS afterwards, and restore my preferred settings.
Those are examples of custom settings. By default, all of that
stuff would be enabled for me. But it slows down the POST, and
I get rid of stuff I'm not planning on using. I have a sound
card, and so I disable the AC'97 sound chip. And so on.
The biggest danger of "bricking" a motherboard, is flash upgrading the
BIOS. What you're doing, is relatively safe, by comparison.
About the only thing that could go wrong, is ESD damage to
the PCI Express slot. Some chipsets are overly sensitive
to ESD on those slots.
There are possible obscure reasons, why a piece of add-in
hardware may not function correctly. For example, in low
memory (below 640K), there is something like 128KB of
memory, to hold add-in BIOS modules. The VESA BIOS
on an Nvidia card, uses 64K of that, and apparently
some of them don't "shrink" after loading. Some cards,
like SCSI, load a certain size of code, and then dump
what they aren't using. If you have enough hardware with
its own BIOS chips, sometimes this results in the
add-in BIOS chip not getting loaded. An example would be
using three SCSI controller cards. The card in PCI slot 1
might get its BIOS loaded, leaving no room for the BIOS of
the card in slot 2 or slot 3. That is an example of a
reason for problems, but if a decent amount of testing
was done (for example, if HP offers a video card upgrade
as a part of the package for that computer), they would
have done testing of a config with add-in video card.
(Mentions the 128KB limit, from a Tyan tech reference)
http://forums.2cpu.com/showthread.php?threadid=29994&highlight=loading+scsi+bios
Paul
.
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