Re: Freeze-ups. Is power supply the only remaining possibility?

Not Here wrote:
On Sun, 07 Oct 2007 20:21:57 -0500, Frank McCoy <mccoyf@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

In alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Not Here <nothere@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Sun, 07 Oct 2007 13:50:56 -0500, Frank McCoy <mccoyf@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

In alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Not Here <nothere@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Sun, 07 Oct 2007 13:28:59 -0500, Frank McCoy <mccoyf@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

In alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Not Here <nothere@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Sat, 06 Oct 2007 19:34:01 -0700, Not Here <nothere@xxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

On Sat, 06 Oct 2007 15:06:48 -0500, Frank McCoy <mccoyf@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

In alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Not Here <nothere@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Apparently the maximum temperature for my CPU is 71 C and I am running
at 70-72. Fan is running at 2800 rpm, I guess I should re-apply
thermal paste?
I'd look *real* close at the whole heatsink/CPU/fan/heatsink-dope
combination. My guess is you aren't getting a good physical connection
between the fan and heatsink.
No kidding. The old paste was quite black. I replaced it and am now
running at a steady 32 degrees while copying between 2 HD's for an
hour or more.

Graham
OK, so when I booted this morning CPU was at 69 C again. I re-applied
the paste, but had no improvement. I used some white stuff (silicone)
that I had left over from a fan/heatsink I got last year. Can it lose
effictiveness?

Graham
A. I'd make *sure* your fan is running properly.
B. Are you sure the clip on the heatsink is holding it down properly?
C. Clean off *all* the old goo before applying new ...
Preferably get "Arctic Silver" compound.
D. It doesn't lose *effectiveness*.
As long as you don't move the heatsink, it will last for *years*.
E. It *does* dry out when exposed.
F. *DON'T* re-use it. Use fresh *after* cleaning off the old.
So how can I be sure I have the right amount. I totally cleaned CPU
and heatsink. The heatsink is not very smooth, some "pits" or
grooves". I put a very thin layer on it, smoothed all off except what
filled the depressions, then a thin (maybe .5 mm) even layer on the
CPU. When I took it apart today there wasn't any excess that had been
squeezed out when I clamped down the heatsink.

Time to replace the heatsink/fan combo.
About $20 US in most computer stores. Likely you can get a far better
all-copper replacement for the same price.

A. There should be *no* pits or grooves in it at all.
B. A very thin layer of Arctic Silver *should* be enough.
However, if you put on a little too much, no problem.
C. Even so, a tiny amount *should* squeeze out around the edges.
If not, something is wrong. Either:
1. The heatsink isn't mounted properly
2. You really didn't get enough on.
3. It isn't tight to the CPU.
4. Etc.
Well, I resolved the pit and groove issue. There was a thermal pad on
the heat sink. I'd never seen one before. So I removed that and have
smooth surfaces thoroughly cleaned with 99% isopropynol. I tried a
thin layer fully covering just the CPU, a thin layer on both CPU and
heatsink, a really thin layer just on CPU and finally a rice grain dab
on centre of CPU only. When I've removed the heat sink there is
evidence of full contact.

Every time the CPU is at 69-72 C immediately on boot to Windows. In
BIOS setup it sits about 40 C.

OK ... So now try a crash-reboot once in Windows and seeing the
70-degree value, using the reset-switch and going immediately to the
BIOS temperature check.

If the BIOS still says around 40C-50C, then your problem is with the
Windows software measuring the temp. If it then still measures high or
close to the same high 60C-70C temperature, then it's the
CPU/heatsink/fan/join problem.

If it's the Windows software reporting a high value, then go to the
motherboard manufacturer's website and get a replacement for the
software. (That might be a good idea anyway.) If they both measure the
same high temp or nearly-so, then replace the heatsink/fan combo.

Divide and conquer.

I was under the impression till now, that you were using the same
program to measure temperature all the time; and were watching it drift
up.


I'll try that, but last night I did have Windows running for hours,
with intensive activity with no problem and the same software reading
32 C.

When I'm showing 70 C I get frequent freeze-ups.

Graham

So are you saying, it is 32C when sitting idle in Windows, and
then zooms up to 70C if you use a program that loads the CPU ?
Like Prime95, Orthos, CPUburn or the like ?

What kind of CPU cooler are you using ? The retail one that
comes with the CPU ? A third party one ?

You've already mentioned that the thermal paste looks like it
is being spread by the applied pressure of the heatsink to the
processor. Is the heatsink secure on the socket ? Do the clamps
or fasteners hold it securely in place ? Based on the progress
in the thread so far, it sounds like you've thoroughly
examined the mounting issues. In which case, I'd look
for a different cooler, if nothing else is working out.

If both the idle and loaded temps were always high, that
might be software. But if the idle reads 32C, and the loaded
shoots to 70C, there are two observations to be made. One would
be, that the thing was capable of reading a low temp, and the
32C shows you that. And stopping at 70C is also significant,
because that is the temperature where an Intel processor would
start to throttle itself (drop internal clocking rate). So all
the symptoms are consistent with a correct temp reading, but
a heatsink with poor overall performance. Like the fan isn't
spinning :-) Or maybe only one corner of the heatsink is
touching the CPU.

To observe throttling, you can try RMClock. Looks like there
is a new version (I was using 225).

http://cpu.rightmark.org/download.shtml
http://cpu.rightmark.org/download/rmclock_230_bin_upd1.exe

There is a screenshot here, of RMClock and the monitor tab.
If the "throttle" (purple) is lower than the "clock" (red), then
the processor is probably throttling, trying to keep the temps
below 70C. I'm not really crazy about their graphing skills,
but this is one of the few programs than might detect
throttling when it happens.

http://www.notebookforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8955&stc=1&d=1143767059

Paul
.

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